first off- hope the surgery was a positive one, are you ok

now, how do you feel about adding those store bought scents to plugs or spoons? do you really think they can make a difference or do they wash right off?

 

also whats the advantage of snap weights over just letting out more line?

 

My bad, I'm doing quite well. Sitting at the computer is no problem.

Scents, the smear on and paste type scents work fine on cranks and hang on for hours. The liquids can be helpful even thought they do wash off fairly soon because they can cover any foreign scent on the lure.
I have a tendancy to not use them very often, but I know there are days (especially the tuff days) when they will put a few bonus fish into a skimpy box.

Snap wts as opposed to longer drop lengths: Snap wts give the added benefit of verticle swim to you lures. The closer the wt is to the lure the more radical that verticle swim. Verticle swim is one of the best triggers, and is almost always of benefit.

Hope this helps, and good luck.

 

Jim

Hope you recover quickly from the surgery.

Still rather new on Erie with lots to learn. Is it correct that snap weights would usually be used off boards to help get the bait to the desired depth? Can they also be used on the lines running directly behind the boat without boards?

Would you explain what you mean by "vertical swim" and how that may trigger bites?

Thanks for the pointers.
Bob

 

Hey ezbite Jim i hope your doing well now you should be as good as new im going to chime in here if you dont mind on scent. I use procure super gel walleye scent on all my cranks and spoons all the time. its the best scent i ever used. Like Jim said on positive days it doesnt matter but doesnt hurt and on neutral and negative days i cant live wit out it. All the people that went on charters and who i bummed rides with this fall all are believers now and wont live with out it either. If you want some i know rodmakers shoppe in strongsville has it if that doesnt work let me know tightlines gary zart blue dolphin

 

Bob, Snap wts add depth to any presentation and can be used on flat lines (straight behind).

The verticle swim I referred to is the up and down movement of the crank or harness that occurs when speed is added (up) or taken away (down). This change in speed can be slighht steering corrections, throttle adjustments, turns, changes in direction, or purposful zig-zagging. Boards maximize this effect because they can surge or sag in the waves, and because of the off to the side condition, that causes a kind of crack the whip effect.

A following walleye detects this change in depth and thinks the prey he is tracking is about to escape, so he attacks.

Lines straight out the back of the boat would minimize this effect but the added wt would inprove seperation between the lures. (The lines with the wts should be the deepest lines and on the inside of shallower lines, to minimize tangles.)

How much depth you add depends on your speed, and your placment of the wt. At 2 mph you'll add about 6-8' per ounce of wt. At 1 mph (spinner speed) you'll add 16 to 20' of depth when placing the wt 50' ahead of the lure and putting 50' of line between the wt and the board or rod tip.

The harder the lure pulls the less the added depth, but even with hard pulling deep cranks like Reef Runners or Power Dive Minnows, you still get some added depth.

I hope I haven't confused you. Thanks for the question, and good luck,

 

A following walleye detects this change in depth and thinks the prey he is tracking is about to escape, so he attacks.

is this also why pumping the rod when trolling sometimes will trigger a strike?

 

Hey ezbite Jim i hope your doing well now you should be as good as new im going to chime in here if you dont mind on scent. I use procure super gel walleye scent on all my cranks and spoons all the time. its the best scent i ever used. Like Jim said on positive days it doesnt matter but doesnt hurt and on neutral and negative days i cant live wit out it. All the people that went on charters and who i bummed rides with this fall all are believers now and wont live with out it either. If you want some i know rodmakers shoppe in strongsville has it if that doesnt work let me know tightlines gary zart blue dolphin

do they have a web site?

 

do they have a web site?

www.pro-cure.com

 

Jim....Sure do hope you have a speedy recovery.

SOOO. We are all anticipating a great Spring bite, both on the reefs and in the deeper water within a couple miles of the reefs. Does anyone have a question to start this off???

COME ON SPRING!!!

Vertical jigging question. I'm assuming drifting will be # 1 choice. Say you are in 15 fow, how much line do you send out? Just enough to stay in contact with the bottom? What about dragging the jig while pumping the rod say a 30 count in 15 fow?

Any advice for jigging would be appreciated. Last year I pretty much missed the reef bite, and caught the tail end of it. I did manage to catch 2 tipped with minnow, but I remember having a ton of line out, it was really windy that day.

Dave

 

Inline board question. Almost all fishing trips there is only my son and I. This year I plan on adding the in line boards to the arsenal. If I have two boards out on each side, how do I deal with the inside board when a fish strikes the outside board? #1 rule on my boat is the driver does not leave the helm, unless to net fish, or get a beer if I am driving. How would you deal with it? Is there any drawbacks to rigging the board so it releases and allow it to move back and around the inside board before you reel it in? I don't like the idea of having to reel the inside board in so you can deal with the outside. I do have a mast and big boards but don't particularly like to use them. Thanks, this should be a TREMENDUS thread!!

 

is this also why pumping the rod when trolling sometimes will trigger a strike?

Rod bumping with mono in my opinion is a waist of time. There's too much stretch in mono to allow any effect at the lure. In essence the stretchyness of the mono absorbs all the movement.
With superbraids that speed goes right to the lure and you are creating a kind of darting effect. Not os much up and down, but more of a dart forward, pause, dart forward thing.
Thanks and good luck.

 

What is the difference in fluorocarbon fishing line and fluorocarbon leader material? I like to use Stren Superbraid with a fluorocarbon leader for trolling and jigging. I have been using Seaguer leader material. I found I can buy 300 yards of P-Line Floroclear http://www.basspro.com/servlet/catalog.TextId?hvarTextId=30721&hvarDept=100&hvarEvent=&hvarClassCode=10&hvarSubCode=1&hvarTarget=browse for $2 more than 27 yards of P-Line Leader material http://www.basspro.com/servlet/catalog.TextId?hvarTextId=51533&hvarDept=100&hvarEvent=&hvarClassCode=10&hvarSubCode=1&hvarTarget=browse . I realize the Floroclear only has a coating of fluorocarbon but do you think it would be ok to use for leaders?

 

Jim....Sure do hope you have a speedy recovery.



Vertical jigging question. I'm assuming drifting will be # 1 choice. Say you are in 15 fow, how much line do you send out? Just enough to stay in contact with the bottom? What about dragging the jig while pumping the rod say a 30 count in 15 fow?

Any advice for jigging would be appreciated. Last year I pretty much missed the reef bite, and caught the tail end of it. I did manage to catch 2 tipped with minnow, but I remember having a ton of line out, it was really windy that day.

Dave

Dave, A 45 degree line angle gives you the control you need in a drift and drag situation. A 1/2 oz jig is good at a drift speed of 1 mph in about 12' of water. Use drift bags to slow a fast drift or your trolling motor to simulate a drift in dead calm conditions.

Go to the upwind side first and drift up onto the reef. If you have a mapping GPS use it to find cups or points and the steepest slopes. These will most often be the sweet spots.

Purple hair jigs with stinger hooks and a 4" minnow is the weapon of choice. The jig heads are tear drop shaped (I've seen them called "river Jigs").

Hope this helps, and be good the game wordens will be watching.

 

Inline board question. Almost all fishing trips there is only my son and I. This year I plan on adding the in line boards to the arsenal. If I have two boards out on each side, how do I deal with the inside board when a fish strikes the outside board? #1 rule on my boat is the driver does not leave the helm, unless to net fish, or get a beer if I am driving. How would you deal with it? Is there any drawbacks to rigging the board so it releases and allow it to move back and around the inside board before you reel it in? I don't like the idea of having to reel the inside board in so you can deal with the outside. I do have a mast and big boards but don't particularly like to use them. Thanks, this should be a TREMENDUS thread!!

Bigger fish will pull the board back enought to clear, but smaller ones do not. If you turn the boat just slightly away from the fish (say 15 - 20 degrees), this will aid in line clearing, but often traffic does not allow this ...so, we've found that bringing the inside board to within 20' of the boat and moving the rod to the other side, works best for us. This allows the lure to keep fishing and minimizes tangles.

There are many ways to clear lines, but to go into all of them would take too much time and just confuse folks.

Hope this helps, Thanks for the question.

 

What is the difference in fluorocarbon fishing line and fluorocarbon leader material? I like to use Stren Superbraid with a fluorocarbon leader for trolling and jigging. I have been using Seaguer leader material. I found I can buy 300 yards of P-Line Floroclear http://www.basspro.com/servlet/catalog.TextId?hvarTextId=30721&hvarDept=100&hvarEvent=&hvarClassCode=10&hvarSubCode=1&hvarTarget=browse for $2 more than 27 yards of P-Line Leader material http://www.basspro.com/servlet/catalog.TextId?hvarTextId=51533&hvarDept=100&hvarEvent=&hvarClassCode=10&hvarSubCode=1&hvarTarget=browse . I realize the Floroclear only has a coating of fluorocarbon but do you think it would be ok to use for leaders?

The biggest difference is tuffness and stiffness, with the leader material being tuffer and stiffer. The leader material makes up into 16 6' leaders, and we like the reliability it gives you. I know guys who use the reel fill stuff for leaders and if you want to... that's fine. I just hope you not disappointed when that big fish of the day gets on.

Make sure you wet up any of the flourocarbon lines before pulling down a knots. They are stiff and if you do not wet the knots they will break.

Thanks for the question and good luck.

 

Glad to hear the surgery went well and you are upright.

This is good idea to cover multiple Erie eye topics in a single thread...you are going to be busy getting to all of the questions!

So here's mine (at least the first one):

Under what conditions would it be advantageous to use a floating style worm harness versus a standard harness. Are the little float beads bouyant enough to keep a 2 hook harness off the bottom so not to snag up or pick up zebras, etc...? I assume the float is for that purpose?...are there other conditions that you would gain an edge using a floating harness presentation?

I made up a few last year but never used them...just curious.

 

Mr Stedke,

Is there a certain time of year when spinner/crawler rigs are more successful?

Do you have a favorite color/blade size/blade style?

What are your thoughts/experiences with tipping them with a Gulp! crawler instead of a real one?

 

Glad to hear the surgery went well and you are upright.

This is good idea to cover multiple Erie eye topics in a single thread...you are going to be busy getting to all of the questions!

So here's mine (at least the first one):

Under what conditions would it be advantageous to use a floating style worm harness versus a standard harness. Are the little float beads bouyant enough to keep a 2 hook harness off the bottom so not to snag up or pick up zebras, etc...? I assume the float is for that purpose?...are there other conditions that you would gain an edge using a floating harness presentation?

I made up a few last year but never used them...just curious.

Floating harnesses is somewhat of a misnomer. It takes many floating beads to float all the hardware of the harness (hooks, blades, etc.) especially if larger blades are used.

If you are creeping along with a #3 or smaller blade in a snaggy location, I suppose a true floating harness might be beneficial. On Erie in open water situations, where suspended fish are the norm, there is no need for floats.

Most tournament fishermen wanting to run a harness close to a snaggy bottom opt for a bottom bouncer & harness arrangement, and shorten up the leader length to keep from snagging too often.

The term "worm harness" means different things to different people. Erie harnesses can be double bladed afairs with one or more treble hooks, and they are short (10-14").

If you would be more specific, I could better understand your situation and tailor the answer to your specific circumstances.

 

Mr. Stedke, Awesome thread here!!! I've only trolled crankbaits a few times with limited success. If there is a go to set-up (program),in your eyes what would it consist of. Thanks in advance. Steve,

 

Mr Stedke,

Is there a certain time of year when spinner/crawler rigs are more successful?

Do you have a favorite color/blade size/blade style?

What are your thoughts/experiences with tipping them with a Gulp! crawler instead of a real one?

On Erie harnesses work well near the reefs in early spring, and will produce lots of fish all through the summer months. From Fairport west the quantity of non-target species ie. white bass, white perch & sheephead somewhat limit thier popularity. But around Geneva and Ashtabula the worm harness rules. They are designed to be fished behind Dipsys or Jets and require a leader or jumper to attach to the divers. In these dep water situations you're fishing for smelt feeding fish, so the irridescent greens and purples are the colors to add to the blades.

My favorite Dipsy harness is tied on 25# flourocarbon leader material. The rear hook is a #4 Excaliber treble, 4" ahead of that is a #4 single harness hook with an upturned eye. Beads are 4 or 5 mm white, light blue, and pink in whatever arrangement you like. The rear blade is a #4 deep cup Colorado copper diamond cut on a quick change clevis. Then more of the same colored beads and a #3 diamond cut copper Indiana blade on an other removable clevis, ahead of that clevis is a single small bead (any color) to help reduce pressure on that front clevis. Then 2 or 3"es of line to a loop tied with a figure 8 knot. I add color to the blades with paint pens or magic markers, one bright green and one purple stripe across the blades at an angle.

You asked.

These harness are simulating smelt, and have done well for me in the deep water off Geneva, Astabula, and as far east as Dunkirk.

Thanks for the question, and good luck.

bout forgot the Gulp!!! Gulp will work but you need to give it a 1/4 twist between the front 2 hooks, to give it some action. Otherwise it pulls too straight. I preferr natural crawlers, but Gulp catches.

 

Mr. Stedke, Awesome thread here!!! I've only trolled crankbaits a few times with limited success. If there is a go to set-up (program),in your eyes what would it consist of. Thanks in advance. Steve,

Steve, Yes there are standard lures, colors, depths, speeds that work at certain times of the year, but they vary by season and location. Give me a date and location and I'll tell you how I'd start out.

(of course you know the pat answer is ...just run the right color of the right lure at the right speed and depth, then simply catch the fish.)

[sorry just couldn't stop myself]

 

OK---- April 20th 55 deg. partly cloudy. 1-3 ft waves mid afternoon

turtle creek area/ west sister

 

Jim,

All the best in your recovery. Very cool of you to share your experience! Youve always seem to enjoy being an educator!

Line Counter question. Ive religously bought Daiwa Sealine Line Counters. Im going to add more Line Counter trolling combos to my collection this year. Obviously, there are more line counters than ever...Obviously you get what you pay....What do you think of the Daiwa Accudepth Line Counters, Cabelas Line Counters etc. I may buy a few Shimano Tekota's but I want to buy other combos too. Could you rank your Line Counter Reel preference? Keep all varieties of trolling line in mind with your response.

Thanks in advance!

 

Geez Jim! Now you've up and done it. I told you it wasn't you and Boatohio, you just needed a new crowd to talk to and it looks like you found it. Nice work!

For those of you that don't know, ETT has had a great message board on www.boatohio.com for many years. I've learned many things from reading and being involved with those threads.

Lately that message board has been real slow (along with many other walleye boards) and I'm sure that Jim is enjoying this thread very much, especially since he's homebound for a while. Don't be afraid to ask him anything, if he doesn't know he'll tell you but there won't be many questions he can't respond to.