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Twist on State Park parking passes...

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Big Daddy, Feb 4, 2005.

  1. Seems the email and letters are getting some attention. This was on the news wire yesterday.

    AP-OH--State Parks-Fee
    Lawmakers try to prohibit state parks from charging fee

    COLUMBUS, Ohio (AP) -- Ohio lawmakers are making a pre-emptive
    strike against a five-dollar fee proposed for state parks.
    Republican Senator Timothy Grendell from northern Ohio says
    making users pay for park access burdens families and the working
    class. He says that the government should get rid of high-paid
    directors instead.
    Today, he introduced a bill that would stop the Ohio Department
    of Natural Resources from creating a parking or entrance fee at
    Ohio's 74 state parks.
    The Department of Natural Resources says it already has made
    cuts and it can't maintain hiking trails, picnic sites and other
    resources unless it gets more money.
    (Copyright 2005 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)
    APNP 02-03-05 1354EST
     
  2. I'm betting on ODNR after all the hoopla shakes out. And I still say any user fee income will be subtacted from State Allocation $'s. So no additional money for: "maintain hiking trails, picnic sites and other
    resources"

    But the OGF community should be congratulated on their efforts, clear thinking and taking action. It sure rattled some cages.

    PS how did it now get to $5 ? I thought it was $25/year ?

    .
     

  3. The $25 is for a yearly pass.

    $5 is per park visit.
     
  4. On Feb 2nd Senator Grendell was the very 1st one to reply to my email(s) and I salute his efforts... Gov'r Taft and ODNR was trying to back door the proposed fees and circumvent us, the voters and tax payers...
    The battle is not over and I for one would like to see something done to help our state parks I am just not sure every avenue was taken before the fees proposal was made...



    Dear Mr. Burrie,
    Thank you for your email. Senator Grendell is opposed to any move to
    charge admission or parking fees at state parks.

    Unfortunately, the ODNR has made the decision to make this change via its
    internal rule-making authority. JCARR members cannot "kill" the rules in
    the way that a piece of legislation can be killed in a normal standing
    legislative committee. The Agency has, in effect, found a way to avoid
    legislative review of the fee issue. JCARR can only move to invalidate rules
    in one of 4 instances. Those are that the Rule was not filed properly
    (this one was), if it conflicts with the intent of the legislature (difficult
    to prove), if it conflicts with another rule (it does not seem to), or if
    it exceeds the scope of the agencies authority (it does not).
    Unfortunately, our hands are somewhat tied.

    Senator Grendell is taking the only available step to stop this from
    happening. Tomorrow he will be introducing legislation that will explicitly
    prevent the ODNR from charging an admission or parking fee at a state park.
    We fear that the only chance this bill has of making it through the
    legislative process is if there is overwhelming grassroots support of the issue.
    For the most part, Ohio's newspapers have been silent or supportive of the
    parking fee. For that reason, we are encouraging everyone who contacts
    our office to contact his or her state representative and state senator and
    urge them to oppose the DNR parking fees. You may also want to urge that
    your friends, family, and colleagues do the same. Another option is to
    write a letter to the editor of your local newspaper. You can also contact
    Governor Taft and Director Speck to voice your opposition to the rule.

    Thank you in advance for your support. If our office can provide any
    additional information, please do not hesitate to contact us!
    Sincerely,
    Beth

    Beth Vanderkooi
    Legislative Aide
    Senator Tim Grendell

    Phone: 614-644-7718
     
  5. Here's an idea - let's get rid of state taxes and make everthing user-fee supported...that way the parking passes will be $20 per day/$300 per year and all of the money will go towards the parks.
    Arguing against an idea without forwarding a better one is ignorant. If you really want to contribute something find out what the total parks budget is and divide that by the number of users. Then cut all state tax funding for the parks and do the math.
     
  6. It is no way my job to find a "BETTER WAY" it is mine as a tax payer to speak and let my voice be heard through whatever process that may be:
    voting, emails, phone calls what have you...
    THANK YOU VERY MUCH :rolleyes:

    Only thing ignorant is your comment...
     
  7. So just bash an idea and don't offer anything better??? What do you think of my entirely user-fee supported idea? If you have any ideas I'd be willing to read them as I am sure Se. Grendell would. I think the same could be extended to every state highway/ route. Cut the tax support and make them all user-fee supported. Then the only people paying for upkeep are those driving on them. Of course you could have an unlimited pass for roads as well.
    User-fees aren't a strange concept. We already have them for utilities and personal consumables.
     
  8. Not one single Senator who replied to my emails, which are included on the prior threads concerning this issue, asked me to debate this user fees thus I do not intend on debating you or your ideas...
    Do as I did and contact a Senator of your choosing and have at it...
    Use your energy in a way that will help you in the pursuit of your feelings on the issue and I'll use mine in my way...

    So in retrospect my answer to you is a resounding no thanks and I'll not direct anymore dialog in your direction or be pushed into the proverbial corner thank you very much...
     
  9. State user pass for State Routes.
    County user pass for county roads.
    Federal user pass for interstates.
    Every city and township...and thats just to drive to work.
    I have a hard enough time carrying all those damn grocery cards.
    Maybe they would use stickers. Your car would look like it came off a NASCAR track.

    An unlimited pass? It wouldn't work. The Feds and State would be sure to get there share but the counties, cities, and townships would be left with scraps.
    Wonder how much would be spent administering all of these user fees?

    The rich neighborhoods drive on pavement while the poor folks drive on gravel?

    Let them eat cake!
     
  10. Very good point(s) Dave...
    Hope you get that boat soon !!! (noboatdave)
     
  11. Guess you guys missed the point.........which is that you guys are enjoying subsidized recreational facilities - and OF COURSE you are against actually paying for what you use.
     
  12. OK, all I can offer is on the "Let's eat cake" comment. Totally offensive to many people. Marie Antoinette was essentially a religious deity, a holy devine figure. If you say this to a Frenchman, then be ready for a fight. I saw it for myself at the Chateau de Versailles. A tourist asked the question to the tour guide and he went absolutely bananas. To even think that she would say such a thing is just wrong.

    Anyway, access to nature is a fundamental need in my book. It should fundamentally supported just like a highway or county road.
     
  13. Your right Master Angler. I'm missing the point where are these subsidized funds coming from? I thought we were paying for the state parkes with our licence fees and tax dollars now. are they getting funding form some other source?
     
  14. I guess that I missed the point too!

    I thought that I was helping pay for the State Parks with my hard earned tax dollars. In addition, I thought that the exorbitant price that I paid for a campsite, dock fees, fishing license and concessions at the park stores also helped to keep the parks running. If the ODNR wants to eliminate the above mentioned charges, I would be all for paying $25 a year for a parking pass!

    Bottom line, the ODNR wants MORE money to mismanage.
     
  15. Amen brother... :D
    But more to the point I really think that Gov'r Taft wants more money to mismanage by not giving the ODNR all the money it should if this fee goes forward... Just like he did when he took away the money in the budget that replaced the money the ODNR lost when it did not charge for hunting/fishing license issued to seniors :mad:
     
  16. These parks were bought with our tax dollars. Millions of acres.
    Personally, I'd love to have millions of acres of my own. I can't afford it.
    If the ODNR can't afford to manage the property's they own with the funds at their disposal, then maybe, just maybe, they have to join the rest of us in the real world and actually manage their money properly.
    If that includes liquidating some of their assets, so be it. I'm sure some of the prime acres will bring in top buck.
    Those funds could then go to manage the other PUBLIC PARKS properly.
    Controversial idea, yup. So is the idea of adding a parking fee without having to answer to anyone.
    I am not completely opposed to a parking fee. It's the autonomy of the ODNR that sticks in my throat.
    atrkyhntr, Attaboy! You've done a fine job.
     
  17. THANKS man... It was and is a battle that I will try to see to the end...
    THANKS to everyone who contacted someone over this issue no matter what your thought process...
     
  18. flounder

    flounder 2 min 30 sec from Hoover

    465
    20
    823
    Would the parking tax be deductable on the state and federal income tax :)

    I'll see that it is on mine LOL. Guess I'll confine myself to Griggs, O'say, and Hoover.

    That is City of Columbus Property.
     
  19. Hey it could be... When I had my guide service I would have wrote it off ;)

    I got to get down that way this summer and do some carp'n
     
  20. AndroDoug

    AndroDoug Duke of Bucketmouth

    655
    1
    721
    Turkey Hunter... Props to you on the effort you have given to fight this extra fee. Also, congrats for holding your tongue when someone basically called you ignorant. It is NOT your job or anyone else's to provide a better solution if you don't have one. Simply letting the people who make the decisions, know when a BAD idea is being forced on us, is better than doing nothing at all.

    I will tell you what is REALLY IGNORANT. Ignorance is someone that only posts 19 times, and all 19 times are negatively connotated attacks against someone or someone's good intentions.

    MA, I don't think you have EVER posted a positive comment or worthwhile report on ANYTHING, either on this site, or especially GFO. Your posts are almost always written in some way to degrade somebody or to infer that in some way you are smarter than anyone else. When, in fact, they are almost always offbase and misguided, not to mention uninformed.

    How has the fishing been lately? Have you had success? What has been working for you? What can you do to HELP the other anglers that make this site their home? (besides bashing some of our hardest working and valuable members)

    Keep up the good work Turkey Hunter and don't listen to the comments from the peanut gallery! ;)
     
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