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Muzzleloader with hornady sst/Thompson shockwave performance?

Discussion in 'Bucks and Does' started by Harry1959, Dec 5, 2017.

  1. Harry1959

    Harry1959 Harry

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    62C5C974-6477-42B5-A52A-D07C6E8D8941.jpeg 8FFD2076-F1B9-4B38-805B-E7712606A820.jpeg I hunt with a tc omega 110 gr BH 209(equal to about 135 gr pyrodex).
    My gun absolutely loves 300 gr sst/shockwaves. 1 inch groups at 100yds. Any other projectile goes to 3-4 inch groups. Tried everything but Barnes variety, don’t know who sells them.
    The last deer I shot with one of the sst was great bullet placement(see pics). Exit hole on deers right side. That deer took a long time to die, went over 300 yards(probably 400)
    and left a sparse blood trail at times. He was still able to run 90 minutes after the pictured double lung shot. The other deer I shot with 300 gr sst was took out both shoulders and died fast. I do however like shoulder roasts.
    Anyone else ever have issues with the sst out of a muzzleloader, or maybe it was just a freakishly tough deer? I have been thinking about trying more loads.
     
  2. Muddy

    Muddy

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    I have recovered SST's from several deer that I killed. They don't expand much at all at with a 100 grain charge of Pyrodex unless they hit major bone structure. But they are more accurate in my gun than anything else. They always get the job done.
     
    Harry1959 likes this.

  3. Lundy

    Lundy Staff Member

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    The 300 grain SST have very poor expansion and the 250 grain version explodes.

    As some some that owns 8 muzzle loaders and has hunted almost exclusively for the last 20 years with them I strongly encourage you to try the Barnes copper bullets from your MZ, you will not be sorry
     
  4. Bass&Bucks

    Bass&Bucks Fire/Medic

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    X 2 on the Barnes copper. Excellent bullet. Switched to them last year. Very accurate out of my accura v2 and hit like a ton of bricks. Read some reviews on them. Very very little if any on poor performance
     
    Harry1959 likes this.
  5. Flathead76

    Flathead76 Carp53.65

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    I quit shooting them years ago. They do not expand well at all. It's like shoving a pencil through a deer. Went back to shooting a hornady xtp bullet in 240 grain. The sst bullet is more accurate at over 100 yards but I rarely get or take a shot over 75 yards.
     
    Harry1959 likes this.
  6. Used to shoot either the 250grn SST or the 250grn T/C shockwaves with the yellow tipped bullet. Both these bullets are made by Hornady
    and with the exception of the SST being red tipped and the TC shockwave being yellow tipped, they are identical. They shot extremely accurate out of the Pro Hunter with 110grns. of BH. Had issues with them practically disintegrating as Lundy pointed out.

    Switched to the 250grn shockwave ' bonded ' bullets ( has blue tip) and never looked back. They function just as well and have not had the exploding problem.
     
    Harry1959 likes this.
  7. Harry1959

    Harry1959 Harry

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    Thanks for the replies. Will find or order some Barnes spitfires t-ez. My omega has a real tight bore and difficult to load even with a clean bore .
    As mentioned, I know the xtp has a real good rep for controlled expansion and killing. I get acceptable 100 yard groups from the ones I’ve shot, but not great.
     
  8. Try some harvester crush rib sabot. you can order from midway or Cabela's my T\C has tight bore. My T\C loves the green sabot for the 44 cal bullet .It won't shoot any else with great with great results at 100 yds.
     
    fastwater and Redheads like this.
  9. buckbob

    buckbob

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    go to www.prbullet.com i started shooting the 200 grain 40 cal. in my 50 cal. cva apex get sub 3/4 in. groups at 100 yds. shot an 8pt. last year at 110 yds. he kicked up hind legs and dropped right there
     
  10. bobk

    bobk

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    Yep, these are a quality product. Last deer went in a circle and fell over dead. I'll stick with lead. I like how the expand. Excellent shooting as well.
    ImageUploadedByOhub Campfire1512560507.945904.jpg
     
  11. Lundy

    Lundy Staff Member

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    Tight fitting bores are not uncommon any more than loose fitting bores are. Both can effect accuracy and a tight fitting bore makes reloading very unpleasant.

    You can typically solve that issue just by using a sabot that better fits your bore. With your tight fitting bore the HPH-24 will probably solve all of your problems no matter what bullet you select. It is 2 thousands smaller in diameter. My buddy has an OMEGA and cussed it like crazy while loading. I purchased the smaller diameter sabots for him to try and he has been smiling ever since.

    http://mmpsabots.com/store/hph-sabot-series/

    The PR bullets are nice bullets, I have killed some deer with them. The primary reason I switched back to Barnes over them is in the event of a poorly placed shot into a shoulder I know how the Barnes copper perform, I'm not sure about the PR bullets. I just decided not to try and fix something that wasn't broken.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2017 at 10:25 AM
    fastwater likes this.
  12. The barnes spitfires wouldn't group past 50 yards out of my TC triumph . I shot lots of bullet and sabot combo. The only combo that worked was harvester crushed rib for 44 bullet. My Omega shot most combo well but I shoot Harvester sabot with barnes bullet. I tried several of easy guide combo and no give groups past 50 yards. I spent lots $ money trying to find the right load for triumph.
     
  13. Harry I’m looking to change as well. Pencil hole in pencil hole out. Hardly any blood. No expansion at all. 250 grain sst powered by 100 grains of triple7. Shot my deer this year at 52 yards. Thank God she stayed in the field and expired. Walked from were she laid back to were I shot her and just had specks for 20 yards. The crew asked me why I was looking so hard for blood when she was laying right there. Told them there’s a story to be told about these ssts. Hit her shoulder broadside.
    Later that afternoon my son using the same set up also shot a doe broadside at 40 yards. He immediately said it was a great shot even seen blood building on her side. Ran did a big u turn and he watched her run into the woods. Ran at least 200 yards before entering the woods. Gave her 40 minutes. We immediately went to where she entered the woods. Real nice pink spray and seen where she rubbed trees for 50 yards then nothing. I was beside myself. Knew she was dead but where? So it was time to mark last blood. Up till then she painted a nice blood trail. The three of us made circles and there she laid another 70 yards. Five yards from where she laid was blood again. Don’t know if the lungs plugged the holes. I have no idea but there where perfect holes through both lungs. No expansion after hitting ribs. I’m not going to keep on doing this.
    So I’ll be testing these loads that you guys are talking about. Too bad I couldn’t push a rage broadhead down the muzzle!! Great information from you experienced muzzles!!
     
    Saugeyefisher likes this.
  14. Lundy

    Lundy Staff Member

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    My son and I have shot bunches and bunches of deer with Barnes expander bullets and have never lost one, even with less than ideal shot placements. Perfect shots, shoulder shots, stem to stern shots, all dead quickly. I have always just shot their expanders, not the boat tails and plastic tips for better BC. Many guys shoot those and like them. I just have always shot the flat based hollowpoint since the mid 90's. If you are shooting a boat tail design and having accuracy issues from your gun try a flat base version. Every gun is different but I have no MZ's that don't all shoot the Barnes very well.

    You spend of bunch of money on guns, stands, cameras, etc, etc and a bunch of time in the woods to get the shot opportunity. I am going to use what I know will deliver the results I want when the opportunity finally arrives. Not all bullets are created equal in terminal performance where it all counts. Drives me crazy when I hear someone say the shoot a certain bullet primarily because it loads easy. I have never killed even one deer while loading my gun.

    To each his own.

     
    chris1162, Tritonman and Harry1959 like this.
  15. bobk

    bobk

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    Lundy, I agree don't fix what's not broken. Just some info on the PR bullets as far a shoulder shots. Not a problem one bit. The last 2 deer were shoulder shot and neither of them left the logging trail.
     
    fastwater likes this.
  16. This is spot on and some very wise info.
    And the mmpsabots.com website is a great source for finding the right sabot for a tailored load. Have talked to their customer service a couple times over the years when trying to accomplish something specific with a load and they have been very helpful.

    Like Lundy having multiple inlines, I currently have four.
    The only one I have found that will shoot as accurate as I expect it to shoot and get proper projectile performance out of the bullet with 'pre-packaged' rounds/sabot and projectile boat together, is the Pro Hunter.
    The other three inlines are all tailored combos of projectiles/sabots that have been purchased separately and have been rounds worked up by trial and error over many years. The end result is usually bags of left over various sabots. Fortunately, I have an outlet for mine as a buddy of mine casts various different kinds/dia.'s of 45cal lead bullets and sends samples to me to 'test drive' for him which is always a lot of fun.
    But IMO, working up the best possible load is just part of the fun of using front stuffers.
     
  17. Lundy

    Lundy Staff Member

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    Bob, I like PR bullets very much I still have a bunch of the 260 gr. I may make you a deal on them since I have basically quit deer hunting. Or I was thinking maybe Tom could field test them but that would require hitting the deer to test the bullet so that may not work:D

    PS, we never lost a deer shot with a PR bullet either. One of the reasons I didn't use them more is they do not work at smokeless velocities well.
     
    bobk and fastwater like this.
  18. :D:D:D
    Even when the topic isn't on EZ, he can't get a break.
    :D:D:D
     
    bobk likes this.
  19. CFIden

    CFIden

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    I have found the 295 grain Power Belts to be very effective. Big blood trails and short tracks.