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Kokosing Sept 8

Discussion in 'Central Ohio Fishing Reports' started by StuckAtHome, Sep 8, 2007.

  1. StuckAtHome

    StuckAtHome Mad SOT YAKER!

    Shwookie and I went north again and Brock made it on the agreed time!!!!! Caught rain all the way there, on and off stuff, once we got on the river it stopped until the last 1/4 mile we got rained on good. Saw a couple more bald eagles, listened to a flock of turkeys making noise and Brock saw what I believe to be a Hellbender, I didn't see it, said it wasn't a mud puppy, about 18-24 inches long, will have to look that up. Also we saw two sets of people MINING SOMETHING from the bed of the river with gas powered equipment that sucks the sediment from the river, sifts it, then returns it in a huge mud cloud, they had a metal detector, think it was for gold? I have never seen anything like it, they had 4 machines set up, with one having the pump motor and all on a small float/boat deal. I need to find out if this is legal, did not like the fact they are disturbing a scenic river with the clearest water I've seen in a big river and the wildlife on the stream bottom, just seems wrong, but they were doing it in a very public spot by a bridge, thought about calling 1-800 poacher but I want to be sure its wrong. Fishing wise Brock had his best day with me yet, he had the biggest fish beat mine by a little(caught my biggest within sight of takeout) but we tore up the rockies and small to medium SM, I even caught a few spots and a sm LM, we caught about 30 fish each, a bunch of doubles but no big gals except a few tweeners. I missed a few big SM that want to run at me full speed when hooked, all in all a good day, its about time Brock pulled his wieght, I get tired of catching all the fish!!! Yea right! I think we are done with the koko this year, back to local flows.
     

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  2. Bubba bass bigfoot

    Bubba bass bigfoot Lucky Fisher, or skilled?

    Nice fish, nice outing. Here i thought i did good today lol.
     

  3. shwookie

    shwookie fishing from a kayak

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    Dang Mike, hit the return key once in a while, lol. I was there and can barely make out what you typed....

    I think it was a mud puppy I saw btw. Looking online, a hellbender just doesn't look like what I saw. I have never seen a mud puppy that big, easily 14", easily. What I saw matches the description of a mud puppy, colorwise anyways.

    Great trip, weather held out until the last 500 yards, lots of fish, and good conversation while floating down the river. Getting one of my rigs pulled in the river was about the only real bummer. Being a shimano and all, it probably wont work now, heh. My new Quantum PTi worked like a charm though, I had a hard time justifying the cost, but dang I wish I had just bought it from the beginning and been done with it. Awesome, awesome reel.

    Also, I want to say thanks to Andy, I used a bait that he gave me a color tip on and I used it 99% of the day. It produced all day.

    /if this ruins your rep here Andy, let me know and I will delete it:D
     
  4. StuckAtHome

    StuckAtHome Mad SOT YAKER!

    I
    didn't
    know
    my
    typing
    was
    being
    judged!

    Mike
     
  5. shwookie

    shwookie fishing from a kayak

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    Well.
    Now you know, lol.
     
  6. I almost took my boys out for a trip to the river this weekend and if I had you probably would have floated past us. That is one of my favorite stretches of the Koko. Very seldom do I go through that stretch and come up empty. It looks like you caught a few decent fish.

    It sounds like the guys you were talking about were indeed running a gold mining screen. I believe it is legal to do on personal property but I am not 100% sure on the regulations on it. What they were doing should do nothing more than stir up the sediment and muddy the water for a ways downstream. They return everything back to the water...except for the few gold fleck that they find.
     
  7. StuckAtHome

    StuckAtHome Mad SOT YAKER!

    I'm still trying to find any info on it, and I believe they were in a public area.
     
  8. The river pretty much runs through private land all the way down even when it becomes the Walhonding.

    I had seen some info online some time back about the gold prospecting but I am not sure what site it was. Here is a bit that the DNR has on their site although I don't think there is anything that will help answer questions as to legality issues.

    Gold in Ohio
     
  9. shwookie

    shwookie fishing from a kayak

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    There actually is an article in todays USA Today on the gold mining of rivers.

    The real problem I have with it is the have their gas powered pumps sitting in the middle of the river. If the pump was on shore, I still wouldn't like it, but wouldn't have as much issue with it.
     
  10. I was not suggesting that all was well with it. I am just saying that if they are on private land I am not sure what restrictions they have on the setup that they use.
     
  11. shwookie

    shwookie fishing from a kayak

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    Oh, I wasn't critisizing you or your post, just stating that a gas powered motor in the middle of the river bugs me.
     
  12. StuckAtHome

    StuckAtHome Mad SOT YAKER!

    You catching a bunch of fish AND the biggest bothers me!
     
  13. There was a GPAA (Gold Prospectors of America) outing that weekend. It was held on private property. Those machines are call dredges. There is no law against there use on private or public land. Studies have proven that this practice is beneficial to fish because it creates ideal clean spawning materials. There is another area they hold outings at the Wade and Gatton nersary above Beleville. This stream is stocked with trout in the same area that they are dredging every weekend and the trout do very well.
     
  14. StuckAtHome

    StuckAtHome Mad SOT YAKER!

    The only problem I have with it is it clouds the water below where they are working, the kokosing is super clear, and below the output pipe there was a very visable mud line for a ways, thats what bothers me.
     
  15. shwookie

    shwookie fishing from a kayak

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  16. Stuckat Home is on the money here. It's HORRIBLE for stream....Horrible.
    It screws up the banks, cuts these huge tailings, knocks a ton of bank sediment into the water, increases mercury levels....on and on and on.
    Anyone who knows much about smalllies understands the type of stream bottom they prefer to live and spawn in. And a drudged up, muddy bottom aint it!

    John D,
    I'd sure like to see the studies that have "proven" that this practice is beneficial to fish. I don't even know what "ideal clean spawning materials" means, but I know I can link you to no less than 50 studies that show that gold mining is devastating to streams and particularly the fish.
    Here's a couple hundred to start:
    http://search.aol.com/aol/search?qu...e=ieToolbar&clickstreamid=-948127063394166573

    In the early 1940s portions of the Middle Fork John Day River was dredged for gold, creating tailings, which are the processed rocks and gravel leftover after the gold was removed, and washed away much of the precious soils from the meadows. Remaining is a degraded and straightened stream channel with little capacity for supporting trees and shrubs.
    Usually, when the water is high, streams widen out onto the floodplain, accommodating the greater volume of water and thereby reducing the stream's velocity and movement of sediment. Because the mine tailings are so high, they essentially block the water from reaching the floodplain, increasing the velocity and flow of sediment which then scours the area downstream. As a result, lower sections below the tailings on the river suffer from degraded banks and erosion. Another problem caused by mining has been the straightening of the channel. The natural meanders of the river have been eliminated, destroying the parts of the river - its shallows and eddies - where fish can rest and spawn. Although the mined channel provides limited spawning and rearing habitat, project sponsors recently have restored some of the natural conditions by removing the tailings along the stream to restore the floodplain, allowing the river to naturally meander once again. However, one section of the river is so entrenched from the dredging that an entirely new river channel may be needed to remedy the degraded habitat.


    "The Oxbow property has incredible restoration potential once the effects of dredging the river have been addressed," says Brian Cochran, manager of the project. "The property has several river restoration projects underway which aim to increase critical spawning and rearing habitat through tree and shrub planting, floodplain restoration, large wood restoration, and river channel restoration."
     
  17. I don't really want to get a &&ssing match started here. I was only trying to enlighten you guys what they were doing on the river, since no one seemed to know.
    andyman's references were taken from years ago, 40's. Those were all very large commercial enterprises that are very heavily regulated now. They had the capability of actually altering the riverbed. They also used to use mercury for gold separation which is also illegal now.
    These guys on the Kokosing were hobby miners that were probably using 2 to 4 inch dredges that takes a full day to displace a pickup bed of gravel. The machine sucks sand, gravel, etc. off the bottom, washes it, thru gravity it seperates any gold that may be in it and discharges good clean washed sand and gravel. The practice is normaly done in the river, not on the banks.
    Ohio has such a small amount of gold and hobby mining activity that it doesn't effect anything. States that have a lot of gold and mining activities, have very strict regulations and go so far as to stop dredging during the normal spawn.
    I am an avid fly fisherman for most species and also do a little gold panning. I have friends who dredge. The piles of washed sand and gravel in the middle of the stream make ideal places for most species to spawn. I have witnessed fish using these tailing piles to spawn. Hobby dredging doesn't creat mud and silt, it actualy gets rid of it in the area the dredge was operated.
    Any of you who have Direct Tv satellite, the outdoor channel (owned by the GPAA) has tv programs about gold prospecting if you're at all interested in learning more.
     
  18. Enlighten? It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know they were panning for gold. But you made a statement that "studies have proven".....that's more what caught my eye.
    I've seen guys with the gas pwered drudging machines many times before. I've seen them also concentrate their efforts more on the bank than the stream bottom. Although the bottom dredging is still very harmful, they can do some serious damage when they target the bank.
    As a fisherman who no doubt understands the fickle environment that Ohio stream smallies swim in, the bottom substrate they prefer, the balance of gentle pools and riffles that encourage spawning........can you really, with a straight face, say that straightening streams, deepening channels, stirring up sediment, eroding the banks.....is GOOD for the fish?

    I'd still like to be enlightened in regards to these studies. You mentioned them as if you had working knowledge of them, so please, feel free. No pissing match, but I think you should certainly offer some kind of supporting documentation.

    I'll eat my crow if they're legit.
     
  19. Gold panning
    The proliferation of riverbed and alluvial gold panning has resulted in serious damage to the basin's rivers, exposing water supplies to serious pollution. About 57 percent of the gold panners use the most destructive horizontal tunneling method of extracting the mineral. During heavy rains, the riverbanks often collapse, resulting in loss of vegetation, erosion and siltation. Chemicals such as mercury are often used adjacent to the water bodies, contaminating rivers and streams.
     
  20. shwookie

    shwookie fishing from a kayak

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    I don't think this will be an issue for some reason.....:)