Jim Stedke's 2011 Mid-winter online seminar

[Jim Stedke]

I am home from the boat show, and to me that signafies that we are past the mid-point of winter. A couple more months and we'll have open water to fish in. It seems ever year I am just a little more anxious to get after them. Last April was one of the best I can remember for fishable weather...let's hope for a repeat.

So... as long as Dale & Kim are OK with it, we'll help the time go by by talking fishin until we can get on the water.

How wants to open the discussion?

[926bill]

How or who?
Just one question. How long do you generally make harnesses when running bottom bouncers? I have all kinds made up at around 5ft, and many made up shorter for casting, are the bouncer harnesses somewhere in the middle?
Thanks for all the great information from all t5he OGF members.


BC:T

[elkhtr]

Jim,

Having read some of your previous posts, I know you have mentioned vertical movement of a bait can be a trigger. Knowing this, have you tried, or what do you think about pulling shallow diving cranks behind an in-line weight?

I mention this as the more subtle action of a shallow diver (an f-13 or f-18 for example) seems to sometimes be preferred by the fish in colder water.

[Jim Stedke]

I'm going to let one of the worm guys answer that. They'l have a more detailed explanation.

[Jim Stedke]

Jim,

Having read some of your previous posts, I know you have mentioned vertical movement of a bait can be a trigger. Knowing this, have you tried, or what do you think about pulling shallow diving cranks behind an in-line weight?

I mention this as the more subtle action of a shallow diver (an f-13 or f-18 for example) seems to sometimes be preferred by the fish in colder water.

Wt assists for shallow divers works well, but be aware that because the shallow diver pulls easier than the deeper divers, it takes less wt to get the effect. So I seldom run more than 1-1/2 oz ahead of them and most often only use 1 oz, and sometimes only 1/2 oz.

Also I'd add, I most often use a rubber band to attach the wt, (instead of an in-line). Just quicker for me.

[c. j. stone]

How or who?
Just one question. How long do you generally make harnesses when running bottom bouncers? I have all kinds made up at around 5ft, and many made up shorter for casting, are the bouncer harnesses somewhere in the middle?
Thanks for all the great information from all t5he OGF members.
BC:T
I'm about as far away from an expert as you can get on this but I'd say longer harnesses for trolling and shorter(15-24") for bouncers(assuming your drifting w/ them). Any longer, and you'll be dragging them on the bottom at drift speeds(just seems logical to me). Now if you had some type of "floating" decoration near the spinner/hooks, that would make a big difference but I don't use them, just beads. JMO.

[bocajemma]

How or who?
Just one question. How long do you generally make harnesses when running bottom bouncers? I have all kinds made up at around 5ft, and many made up shorter for casting, are the bouncer harnesses somewhere in the middle?
Thanks for all the great information from all t5he OGF members.


BC:T

All my bottom bouncing harnesses are tied at 36". No issue with dragging bottom even if I am tapping the bottom with the bottom bouncer. I made an 18" jig for tying up my casting harnesses/mayfly rigs and just double the line for bottom bouncing harnesses. I drift fish mostly and that length works well for me.

[K gonefishin]

I use the same spinners for inline weights that I do for bottom bouncers these rigs are in the 5 ft range I troll from .8 to 1.6 mph with them, I don't have any issues with them whatsoever, no use tying 2 different length harnesses IMO.

[Lewzer]

I have a question for you Jim Stedke.
Do you do any inland walleye fishing or are you a strictly Erie guy?

[Jim Stedke]

I live about 20 minutes from Indian Lake, and fish there a few times a year, mostly just for fun, and hardly ever keep any saugeyes. My favorite lures at Indian Lake are Little Rippers.

I did do some inland tournaments a few years back, fished Mosquito, Berlin, Indian, Alum Creek, etc, but Lake Erie is were I spend most of my time.

[926bill]

Well I just tied up four harnesses at around 36" long. Maybe I won't waste anymore spinners,beads,and hooks. I haven't used bottom bouncers much but was looking for a different option when the conditions change. I'm usually trolling and just getting into this game! Boy is this fun, even though this is winter.

BC

[ApeShip]

Jim,

You say:

Also I'd add, I most often use a rubber band to attach the wt, (instead of an in-line). Just quicker for me.

Could you go into some detail on this? What kind of weights, where to buy, rubber band weight?

Thanks.

Regards,
Fran

[Jim Stedke]

We use a #14 Crepe Rubber Band (they are red, tougher than the brown bands, and kinda slick). Sun doesn't deteriorate them as quick, and we use them to attach big board lines to the release clips as well. We sell them for $7.00 for 1/2 pound (about 600 bands).

The wts are tear drop shape (like the snap wts) and have a brass loop on 1 end (some have a loop on both ends), available at most tackle stores.

To attach a wt to a line you push the band throught the loop on the wt, put the loop through the other loop and pull it tight. To attach it to the line wrap the band around the line, pass the sinker through the band and cinch it down. We usually place the sinker only only 5 or 6' ahead of the lure, but we troll fairly fast (summer speeds usually 2.4 - 3 mph), and many put the sinkers much further ahead. We believe the closer to the lure, the more radical the movement.

At 5 or 6' ahead of the lure, we don't remove the wts, until we are done fishing.

Hope this helps, jim

[ApeShip]

Got it Jim. Thanks.

[jfcar]

Hi Jim
When using speed and temp probe, I thank I understand the speed side but what advantage or how does the temperature reading help.

[Jim Stedke]

The primary use of the temp is to indentify the thermocline. And with the probe you can identify it before it becomes abvious on the sonar.

[Workdog]

Talking about thermocline, Jim. Do you or any of your friends run the new Lowrances with the Down Imaging, and does that do as good a job highlighting thermoclines as the company says it does, or can an older technology LCX-37C, for example, show thermoclines nearly as well?

[Jim Stedke]

I'm no help with Lowrance units. Maybe someone else can help out.

[jfcar]

Jim do you fish the thermocline or the makes on the fish finder.

[Hetfieldinn]

Talking about thermocline, Jim. Do you or any of your friends run the new Lowrances with the Down Imaging, and does that do as good a job highlighting thermoclines as the company says it does, or can an older technology LCX-37C, for example, show thermoclines nearly as well?

Set the sensitivity on your 37 between 88-92%, and the thermocline should show up nicely.

[Jim Stedke]

jfcar, Most of the time walleyes will be on or above the thermocline. But I most often fish the highest marks (even if there are more marks deeper). I feel the higher the marks the more aggressive the fish.

In warm water, I often run a lure in the top 15' of the water column, even if there are no marks because fish that high will not stay under the boat with water temps over 50 degrees.

Last year it seemed like you had to fish well above the marks (sometimes 12 or 15') to get the fish to hit.

We start with the deepest lures 3-5' above the depth of the most marks, and spread things out above that.

In a big boat charter situation (10 - 16 lines) we may run 2 Dipsys right at the depth of the most marks.

[2CatchEyes]

Talking about thermocline, Jim. Do you or any of your friends run the new Lowrances with the Down Imaging, and does that do as good a job highlighting thermoclines as the company says it does, or can an older technology LCX-37C, for example, show thermoclines nearly as well?

Just break down and buy a probe. Marine General usually has the Depth Raiders at a good price. That way you will know were the temp break is and how fast your lure is truly running. I'll even help you install it.

[Sir Walter]

Jim, do you fish the reefs in early spring with hair jigs and blade baits or do you strictly troll?

[rizzman]

Mr. Stedke, no question but just want to say I've been looking forward for the winter seminar to start and keep up the good work. Also the boats ready to go, shooting for March 16 this year. Get your warm cloths ready.... And everybody remember the "Stedke rule". It saved me from more than a few "skunked" days this year.

[Jim Stedke]

Sir Walter, I fished the reefs twice last year and trolled all the other days I got to fish.

The reefs are great fun but I love catching big fish and the chance of a big fish is never better than prespawn. So it hard for me to jig when I know a few miles away most of the oversized fish in the lake are looking for something big to eat.

I've been trolling in March and April for more than 15 years and have confidence in my ability to make it work.

I hesitate to talk too much about it because of the fact that the cold water is nothing to be trifled with, and safety must be considered. It is just no time to be out there with anything other than top notch equipment. I've been on the water 4 different times when a fellow fisherman lost his life, and I sure don't want to encourage anyone into taking risks.

[Jim Stedke]

Rizz, Yes Sir!!

[c. j. stone]

And everybody remember the "Stedke rule". It saved me from more than a few "skunked" days this year.
I think I've heard a "few" of these over the years, Rizz, but could you elaborate on this one for us??

[JIG]

Jim what can you tell me about hummin down-rigger cables? Good thing or bad? Seems I do ok with one down but two seem to much. Is there anything that will illiminate this?

[Workdog]

Set the sensitivity on your 37 between 88-92%, and the thermocline should show up nicely.
Thanks Het! End of this past year, my Sitex had a glitch and I was contemplating the Lowrance Elite 5 DSI Color Sonar/Plotter. If my Sitex hangs in there this year I'll keep what I got and fine tune the 37.

Just break down and buy a probe. Marine General usually has the Depth Raiders at a good price. That way you will know were the temp break is and how fast your lure is truly running. I'll even help you install it.
Appreciate that Curtis. I'm running a little tight on space at the transom. I'll have to see if I can make room for a rigger.

[K gonefishin]

Jim what can you tell me about hummin down-rigger cables? Good thing or bad? Seems I do ok with one down but two seem to much. Is there anything that will illiminate this?

I know you didn't ask me but I follow NY salmon fishing and alot of guys run a very heavy power pro, it doesn't hum and alot of guys like running it.

[rockytop]

I think I've heard a "few" of these over the years, Rizz, but could you elaborate on this one for us??

charlie see if i remember jim alwayes told rick to keep a few lines high in the water column.

[JIG]

Thanks K-Gone! Might have to try that. Sounds like it might do the trick.:T

[Jim Stedke]

c. j. stone, This "Stedke rule" thing is all Rick's doing. But I do like to put out a high feeler every so often. That's the only way to know if there are high fish around....you sure can't matk them in warm water, and in cold water I already know for a fact that they are there, unless bad weather has pushed them down.

[rizzman]

You got it Rockytop, He made me a believer every time I fished with him. I would be running harnesses DEEP on my side, Jim would run RR's up high and catch just as many, if not more. He loves going for those high fish, and so do i now. It's hard to do when all the marks are down deep but give it a shot, you'll be amazed how many are up high you dont pick up on the screen "The Stedke rule"

[wanderin_eyes]

Jim,
When Trolling the pigs in the spring Do you use 700's or 800's. And whats the speed that works for them? I know I don't want to pull them at 3. just wondering in it needs to get down under 1mph.

Thanks for the wisdom.

[Jim Stedke]

Steve, I start w/ 800s, Dp Huskies & Dp Rouges at 25 - 80' set backs. Many work real slow, (like 0.8 - 1.3 mph), but I seldom run under 1.5 and 1.8 would be my start speed.

If the short drops go, I may go to stick baits (minnow lures), and start them 30 - 60' back.

More than likely the water is going to be stained to dirty, but visability of 16 - 24" is fishable. Expect the dirtiest water to hold way more fish than cleaner water, but those fish are nearly uncatchable.

Look for scattered high marks, and if you see bait all the better.

Some better colors are emerald shinner, eriedescent, cheap sunglasses, bubble gum, spotted sunset, pink panties, and bare nakeds that match. The deep Gold Rouge (that looks coppery) has been good to me.

This is not at the edges of the reefs, but further off like in the area of the firing range cans, and can run east all the way to Mouse or Green Island.

If the water is dirtier (visability of 12" or less) the best colors are mud minnow or Texas Red.

There ya go. Good luck.

[wanderin_eyes]

Thanks Jim. I knew they were off the reefs by the cans. Just not sure speed and didn't think about the color. I've heard people trolling along the mud line with some running just inside in the dirty water and the other side in the clean. They say they hide in the dirty water and ambush into the clean. any truth?

[Jim Stedke]

When the marks are scattered both in depth and location, I have a hard time thinking of the walleyes being in ambush mode. I like working trasition water that is between clean and dirty, but the dirtier water is warmer and I think the fish in it are looking for the heat not food. So there is truth to it but I don't think it applies too much way early.

Bear in mind the clean to dirty line may not drop straight down to the bottom, it likely tappers one way or another, so the transition at depth may be inside the mud or outside. A more usual situation is that you need to get away from the dirtiest water to find the high scattered marks that indicate hunting fish.

good luck... Jim

[wanderin_eyes]

Thanks. I'll keep a seat open this year for you.

[Jim Stedke]

Good deal. We've exchanged enough info here, I already feel like I know you.

[Gottagofishn]

I don't have a question at this time either but also would like to thank everyone that particapates in this. The information that is available here is unbelievable in amount and quality. I too have been looking forward to this.
Thanks again!

[Jim Stedke]

Happy to help. Let's hope for a nice fishy April.

[eyewannago]

Jim do you and Rich ever pull Deep Little Rippers or Ripshads around the islands in late spring early summer. Joe

[jcwalleye]

when trolling for walleye with cranks & harnness and your catching yellow perch and white bass . am i running lures too deep? i think the perch & w bass would try to stay deeper than the walleye that feed up. thanks jc.

[Jim Stedke]

Jim do you and Rich ever pull Deep Little Rippers or Ripshads around the islands in late spring early summer. Joe

Joe, Rich stays w/ the 800s because the slide down the tow lines better. In little boats w/ in-line boards we can do whatever, and I do (sometimes), but I'd guess 90% of the time I pull 800s.

The time that Dp Lil Rips shine is when spoons first start (late May or early June), but as soon as the 5" white perch start, I go back to 800s.

[Jim Stedke]

jcwalleye, Yellow perch on harnesses likely means your dropping down a bit too far. I'd shorten Dipsys or in-line wts 20 or 30' (both drop significantly as speed is reduced).

White bass or white perch can, and often do, work at the same depth or higher than the walleyes. In the west end about all you can do to reduce their numbers is to up-size your lures or move away from them.

The big walleyes will key on the small white perch, but I have trouble dealing with 10 or 12 white perch for every walleye. So I move on.

[Sir Walter]

Jim in this scenario, its the second week of April, light south winds, the jig bite has been good for a week on the reefs for nice males, but I want to try for a trophy walleye. The water clarity is perfect for trolling, so where should I target bigger walleyes?

[Jim Stedke]

From 1/2 miles inside B,C,D,E cans to 1 mile outside, and from there towards Green & Mouse. Big area full of big fish.

This is all deeper water, and shallower towards Port Clinton can produce as well.

There is no sweet spot. They are where you find them. It's the classic hunt for them before you can catch them.

[rizzman]

Sir Walter, It's a big area like Jim said, Last season I "tag teamed" the area with three other OGF boats, we all took a different area. Once a guy was picking them steady in a area we would move to them, once the bite stopped we would spread out again to find some more. We covered alot of water and got some nice fish. I guess what Im saying is put up a post when you plan on going and hook up with other OGFers on the water, plenty of fish for all... Jim sorry for butting in, wont happen again...LOL

[wanderin_eyes]

Jim,
Do you use any custom paint RR and husky or just stick to the"over the counter" ones?

Also any favorite flavor over the other?

[Jim Stedke]

Sir Walter, It's a big area like Jim said, Last season I "tag teamed" the area with three other OGF boats, we all took a different area. Once a guy was picking them steady in a area we would move to them, once the bite stopped we would spread out again to find some more. We covered alot of water and got some nice fish. I guess what Im saying is put up a post when you plan on going and hook up with other OGFers on the water, plenty of fish for all... Jim sorry for butting in, wont happen again...LOL

SORRY !!! What the h e double hockey sticks you talkin about??? If you have something to add....add it. And everyone else as well.

Good advice, no need to be sorry.

[Jim Stedke]

Jim,
Do you use any custom paint RR and husky or just stick to the"over the counter" ones?

Also any favorite flavor over the other?

I use magic markers to colorize or customize colors as need arises. I do have a few customs and some prototypes to test for Scott, but 95% plus of my walleyes are caught on std colors/

Go to colors for spring were posted earlier, here's a copy:
Some better colors are emerald shinner, eriedescent, cheap sunglasses, bubble gum, spotted sunset, pink panties, and bare nakeds that match. The deep Gold Rouge (that looks coppery) has been good to me.



Read more: http://www.ohiogamefishing.com/community/showthread.php?p=1146822&posted=1#post1146822#ixzz1CCIwUByi

[wanderin_eyes]

Thanks Jim,

I got the spring ones saved to memory :D I was just courious about the rest of the year. Thanks for answer it I never thought about a marker. Thanks for the tip. I'm going to have to stick one in the boat

[Jim Stedke]

I have nearly 30 diferent color markers that I carry. But Flour pink, chartruse, and orange are among the most important.

[wanderin_eyes]

Thanks Jim Heading to the hobby store to get markers.

I may end up catching clown fish by coloring them wrong but I'll try to restrain myself;)

[Jim Stedke]

You can remove the colors by hitting them quickly w/ finger nailpolish remover. A quick swipe, the polish remover will attack the clear coat.

[wanderin_eyes]

Thanks again
I'm ready for the fishy April. but why stop there lets go Apr. - Nov!!!

[Big Papa Sports]

Jim Stedke thank you for your great insight, to some great questions.

[Jim Stedke]

No problem. With the best walleye lake in the world to play in, I like to help folks be successful.

And a majority of the time I end up gaining some info as well. And besides we've all got to endure an other 6 or 7 weeks of winter.

Come on Spring!!!

[wallykiller]

I fished my butt off last season, trying to catch that trophy walleye.

Would I have a better chance in the spring or fall?

Also after reading, I can better my odds to skip the blade bait jiggin and troll?

Thanks for all your time and info!!!

[Jim Stedke]

A higher percentage of your catch will be over 10 in the Spring (April), but you'll catch more fish in the fall (Nov.).

My 2 biggest last year were both caught in the Spring.

[Ogre]

Hey guys I'm new on here and I thought that it would be prudent if I reviewed the 4 previous on line seminars before posting my question. So I did that and here's what I got. Jim I met you and your brother at the fishing college seminar at the boat show, and after speaking with you guys I have decided that I am going to make the switch to mono for my board rods. I do plan on doing quite a bit of night fishing in the spring and was wondering if I should make the switch after that is over. One of my buddies mentioned that he thought braid was a must for fishing in shallow due to snags. I appreciate you taking the time to answer my question and look forward to many more posts. Andy

[Jim Stedke]

Andy, I fish at night some and don't get snagged up hard all that often. So my mono is not causing me to lose lures. But if you are fishing in areas where lure are commonly lost, I'd probably stay with braid. Make sure you back off the drags, and take your time with the fish. If you feel them shaking thier head....stop reeling until they settle down. You'll still have some get off but that should help minimize the rip-offs.

[Ogre]

Jim thanks, I think I will stick with the braid until the night bite is over. We night fish mostly off of Vermilion between Sherod and Cranberry Creek and there is some really nasty lure eaters off of Sherod. Andy

[tked1950]

Jim, I'd like to thank you, your brother and others for the great seminar at the boat show. By the way, I should have won the door prize on Saturday for longest distance, I checked it on the way home and found we'd traveled 263 miles one way from Mooreland, Indiana. LOL
The costs of our trips up there are really escalating. I check the satelite views for water clarity in the spring, but I'm not sure what I'm looking for when it comes to good fishable conditions. Can you help me out with this?
Thanks!!!

[Jim Stedke]

Jim, I'd like to thank you, your brother and others for the great seminar at the boat show. By the way, I should have won the door prize on Saturday for longest distance, I checked it on the way home and found we'd traveled 263 miles one way from Mooreland, Indiana. LOL
The costs of our trips up there are really escalating. I check the satelite views for water clarity in the spring, but I'm not sure what I'm looking for when it comes to good fishable conditions. Can you help me out with this?
Thanks!!!


The satalite views come up so late in the day, that they are only usable for trying to anticpate what the next day's water conditions may be. And they can chage significantly over night.

About the only thing any of us can do is study the satalite view and check the wind forecast, the hope the weather man is right.

For wind I like the "iwindsurf.com" site because it gives you hour by hour on direction and speed, instead of a 10 -20 NW for the day. This makes for better planing and timing.

What to look for, streakiness usually means that water is getting dirty, a hint of green is usually fishable, clean water at the shore line or along the islands mean curents are bringing cleaner water in.

The satalite views can sometimes give you false hope, but they are way better than nothing.

Hope this helps, come on Spring!!

[Sir Walter]

Jim, I downsized my boat last year, went from a 23 ft Wellcraft and used the big catamaran boards for trolling to an 18ft Starcraft sportfisherman where I now use the offshore in-line boards. They are great. All crankbaits such as 800 Reefrunners,DHJ, Taildancers and then crawler harnesses with in-line weight or bottom bouncers are my favorites to run. But when my buddies were using 30 jets and small mini streaks or small stingers off of big boards once the spoon bite took off, I switched over too and used 30 jets off my off shore boards and couldn't get them to go as far as catching numbers like the other guys were doing. My speed seemed ok, but while my buddies were catching #s of walleyes, I struggled and I was fishing the same area. Any tips on running Jets off of in-line boards.

[BFG]

Interested in this one too, as I fish on different boats all the time and without a doubt...the inliners catch fewer fish w/ discs and jets than the big boarders.

I maintain (for the discs at least) that the angle of the line on the tow line and then the difference between how inlines ride in the water vs. big boards is the primary difference.

But...I am not sure.

Waiting on ya' Jim.......:)

[Jim Stedke]

Sir Walter, The only thing I can think of would be too much surge (if it was rough). If you're fishin deep enought to run Dipsys that may help.

Did you take into account the amount of line out of the water from the release to the water w/ big boards (it varies from 0- 25' as you come up the tow line. So little boards need to be run 10 - 15 shorter to get the same depth.

One other thought....check your reels for calibration. That is mesure off 100' with a tape and see how close your reels come. Some can be off 25 - 30 %. And have your buddies do the same. It can be eye opening.

good luck.

[Jim Stedke]

Interested in this one too, as I fish on different boats all the time and without a doubt...the inliners catch fewer fish w/ discs and jets than the big boarders.

I maintain (for the discs at least) that the angle of the line on the tow line and then the difference between how inlines ride in the water vs. big boards is the primary difference.

But...I am not sure.

Waiting on ya' Jim.......:)

There's no doubt little boards surge more in any waves than big boards, and rougher it is the worse the problem.

A Slider on the Planer board line reduces the problem, but you end up hand over handing the fish, which some find uncomfortable.

No solution except getting a big board set up.

[Sir Walter]

Thanks Jim, I didn't take into acount the difference of the big board to in-line board as far as distance back. If they said they were running 30 jets back 70ft at 2.3 mph and doing good, thats the leads I would run and the speed too. Like I said, after running big boards forever, learning to run in-lines has been a new experience. like I said, harnesses and crank baits are a lot easier.

[fishingguy]

If I can jump in Jim, if your running harnesses and inline weights in rough water, you can move your weight up to maybe 30' or so in front of the harness. Use a snap weight clip or a rubber band as I do. This will soften the jerk from the boards and the harness will run a lot less herkey jerkey. Let the fish tell you which they like better.

[Jim Stedke]

Good point. Going from an in-line wt to a snap wt further forward will reduce the surge on the spinner.

Thanks.

[Buckeye Ron]

Jim,
" One other thought....check your reels for calibration. That is measure off 100' with a tape and see how close your reels come. Some can be off 25 - 30 %. And have your buddies do the same. It can be eye opening."

Each year, I refill my reels with line and measure off a 100 ft and pull the line off to see what the LC says on my reels. I use the daiwa 27 LC Accudepth reels. Each year i come up with different figures. I place pieces of tape on my rods with Plus's or Minus's on how far off the measurement is from the 100 ft mark. Is there another way of doing it?

Thanks,
Ron

[Mel]

To adjust line counter accuracy if lc reads less at 100 I ad more line to backing or if reads more I subtract. Change total amount of line on reel. Mel

[Jim Stedke]

If your reel is full and reading over 100' the only thing you could do would be go to a smaller dia. line (lower pound test) and I would not suggest that. So all you can do is mark the with the percent that it reads high, and adjust accordingly.

If your reel is reading under 100' you can stripe off some line, and get the spool to a point that 100' reads true.

I think that's right.... anyway....you can fix one and not the other.

[wanderin_eyes]

Do HJ need tuning like RR and are they as touchy?

[Jim Stedke]

Yes They need tuned as do all crank baits and stickbaits, and no they are not as touchy.

Understand, you will learn to tune Reef Runners with a little practice, and it won't be a big deal.

[wanderin_eyes]

I think I figured out the correct way to check them. I keep the speed i'm trolling let about 8' out and see which way it running adjust and check again til straight. It just seems at time I touch the eye and it goes the other way.

But I do belive having it tuned right is the diffrence between catching fish or catching a :S

I haven't pulled HJ or anything else yet just wondered if their that touchy

Thanks for the answer

[Jim Stedke]

They are very touchy, and it's important not to overtune them and bend the eye both ways. That weakens the eye and makes the lure that much easier to knock out of tune. I tell people that if they feel the eye move, they have gone too far, so your kinda right, just breath on it and sneak up on the sweet spot.

When you get it to pull straight, then surge the lure by pulling it forward w/ the rod, and if the lure wants to pull either way consistantly then give it the slightest correction until when you surge it, it goes both ways equally. Then you've got a super tuned fish catchin machine.

[wanderin_eyes]

I love the way they work and will keep pulling them. practice, practice, practice. I'll get it down.:T:T

[tked1950]

[QUOTE=Jim Stedke;1145355]We use a #14 Crepe Rubber Band (they are red, tougher than the brown bands, and kinda slick). Sun doesn't deteriorate them as quick, and we use them to attach big board lines to the release clips as well. We sell them for $7.00 for 1/2 pound (about 600 bands).


When you say "we sell them for $7.00 per 1/2 pound" where do you mean????
Is there somewhere I can order them online??

[eyewannago]

Jim I'll add on tuning to rip your rod tip forward if you have it tuned then you are good to go on outside turns or speeding up. Joe

[Jim Stedke]

[QUOTE=Jim Stedke;1145355]We use a #14 Crepe Rubber Band (they are red, tougher than the brown bands, and kinda slick). Sun doesn't deteriorate them as quick, and we use them to attach big board lines to the release clips as well. We sell them for $7.00 for 1/2 pound (about 600 bands).


When you say "we sell them for $7.00 per 1/2 pound" where do you mean????
Is there somewhere I can order them online??

We had them w/ us at the Cleveland Boat Show. It's Rich's deal, and I'd have to check w/ him about mailing them. Be glad to ask him if you'd like.

[OhYeah]

Jim,
At the show were you able to check out those "new" mini big boards - I think you mentioned running 1 board from a vertical Saltwater Rod'n'Reel and they'd hold maybe 3 lines out to the board ?? I think you mentioned 'em back in the fall.

GR

[TDW]

What about scents? Are any of you using scents? Have you seen any improvement in using them? Do you use them on worms, minnows, lures, etc.? What brand and type do you use?

Thanks - great forum and topic.

[HappySnag]

Jim
can you describe how you will fish for eyes of Catavba with 1 guy, on May 1.
asume you have no information about fishing only map and you never bin there.this is your first time.boat is eqiped for all fishing.troling,casting,jiging.
1.how you look for fish?
2.how you set up your rods?
3.whot lure you use?
4.how deep you run lure? why?

thanks snag

[tked1950]

[quote=tked1950;1148199]

We had them w/ us at the Cleveland Boat Show. It's Rich's deal, and I'd have to check w/ him about mailing them. Be glad to ask him if you'd like.

I would appreciate that. Obviously there's no big hurry, just whenever you find the time. Thanks

[Jim Stedke]

Gary, They are new enough that no one had any experience w/ them. And neither do I. But I plan on playing w/ them this Spring. (and I think they'll work out).

[Jim Stedke]

What about scents? Are any of you using scents? Have you seen any improvement in using them? Do you use them on worms, minnows, lures, etc.? What brand and type do you use?

Thanks - great forum and topic.

I tip cranks on days when teh fish are neutral to negative, with a small pc of crawler on the belly hook of the Reef Runners. That just about does it for me.

[Jim Stedke]

Jim
can you describe how you will fish for eyes of Catavba with 1 guy, on May 1.
asume you have no information about fishing only map and you never bin there.this is your first time.boat is eqiped for all fishing.troling,casting,jiging.
1.how you look for fish?
2.how you set up your rods?
3.whot lure you use?
4.how deep you run lure? why?

thanks snag

Having fished there all my life there's no way I can pretend I've never been there.

If your coming for the first time, you do all you can to gather info, research this site for early May locations and techniques.

Exactly what I'll be doing is dependent upon how thw Spring breaks, but by the 1st part of May there should be fish on the reefs and in the islands both. Most of the larger fish will be gone east, but cranks and harnesses should be going. It's a couple weeks early for Jets and spoons. Exact locations are dependant on weather and water conditions.

West Reef, the slot between Middle & North Bass, N bay of Kelleys, and Gull may all be good choices.

A typical spread for 4 lines would be Reef Runners set at from 40 to 120 back depending on where you mark the most fish. If you hear that high fish are available you could either run in line harness (1oz - 30 back or 2 ozs - 20 back). Or Rips sticks 40 -100' back may be good as well.

If there's a tournament in the area infomay be scarse, but PMs will be answered, so don't be bashfull.

Hopethis helps, Come on Spring!!

[eyebustor]

What about scents? Are any of you using scents? Have you seen any improvement in using them? Do you use them on worms, minnows, lures, etc.? What brand and type do you use?

Thanks - great forum and topic.
I read this and started thinking. I have fished in a few tourneys as a coangler and thinking back most of the pros I've fished with used a scent when fishing rivers but I don't recall any of them using it when out on the lake. Most of them used Gulp Alive and dipped any bait they happened to be using in it even if it wasn't a gulp bait. Just an observation. I have used several different types myself with some on one side of the boat and none on the other and I really can't say I noticed a difference with walleyes but it did seem to make a difference on steelhead while trolling spoons. Not consistantly though.

[HappySnag]

Jim-Thanks,
that gives me confidence if i know whot i am doing.

snag

[elkhtr]

Do the fish in the early spring hold in small packs like the do in late fall, or are they typically more scattered?

[Jim Stedke]

Not at all, they are scattered. But the areas of scattered marks can be defined on breaklines or adjacent to reefs. I don't think I've ever seen a time when a target depth was definable from the marks, but nearly always we are fishing the top 15'.

[rickerd]

Jim,
I thought of this on the way to work today. A few times out last year, I noticed a boat trolling through a pack, had a bunch of seagulls following it. The other boats didn't seem to have the company.

When I first came upon them, I thought of following them thinking they were catching fish. Now I think, maybe it was just small WP that they were feeding to the gulls.

Can there be any positive reasons the gulls were following them? Do you ever use feeding gulls to help find walleye?

Thank you again Jim for your Winter classes.
Rickerd

[normd]

I tip cranks on days when teh fish are neutral to negative, with a small pc of crawler on the belly hook of the Reef Runners. That just about does it for me.


I agree with this tactic. It has helped me in the past. I always make sure i have a least a dozen crawlers on board even if i'm not intending to troll harnesses.

[Jim Stedke]

rickerd, My guess would be that they had either small white perch on the lures, or they had untuned lures running near the surface, or they had weeds on the lures making them run high.

I doubt they were feeding the gulls.

When a gull circles behind your boat and acts interested in the water near where you estimate your lures to be running, check your rods and I'm betting something is amiss.

[Jim Stedke]

Tipping a crank is not going to get a limit, but it will put a few more fish in your box on tuff days.

If the fish are going, it's a waist of time.

[Seaturd]

I'm interested in how the currents on Lake Erie affect the walleye, how the fish relate to them, how to identify them, etc. Any and all info, links, what have you are welcome... mostly interested in area from islands to the sand bar. Mr. Stedke has declared limited knowledge on this subject so anyone else please chime in.... :D

[SELL-FISH]

I'm interested in how the currents on Lake Erie affect the walleye, how the fish relate to them, how to identify them, etc. Any and all info, links, what have you are welcome... mostly interested in area from islands to the sand bar. Mr. Stedke has declared limited knowledge on this subject so anyone else please chime in.... :D

First off there is always current in Lake Erie somewhere and walleyes love to feed in areas where there is current. I used to fish primarely open water charter style fishing, big boards, wire line, 2 mile leads yada yada. This style of fishing I wouldn't be caught dead with out a speed/temp probe, because of the varying speed difference that can occur between the surface and the targeted depth speed. The last 6 years I have mainly fished shallow structure related style fishing which is by far my favorite way to fish for walleye. Mainly for two reasons short runs and short leads, I used to hate to look down at LC reel and see 420 on the counter, to reel in what feels like piece of drift wood. Secondly short runs which equals low fuel costs, two summers ago when fuel hit 4 bucks a gallon I never fished deeper than 45 fow and caught piles of eyes. Many days never leaving very very shallow water including August where I had 80 degree plus surface temp and still smashed em. Current in shallow water areas still plays a big role but is alot easier and cheaper to figure out. Stick your bait in the water and watch it swim if its giving you the look you want your good if not adjust your speed accordingly. Hope this helps Scott.

[RBud1080]

I'm interested in how the currents on Lake Erie affect the walleye, how the fish relate to them, how to identify them, etc. Any and all info, links, what have you are welcome... mostly interested in area from islands to the sand bar. Mr. Stedke has declared limited knowledge on this subject so anyone else please chime in.... :D

Sellfish nailed it, but let me add a little.

Anywhere you see a significant geographical feature (avon point, pelee point, and island, etc, there will be significant current. And there will be fish. I once heard a quote "luck is when current meets structure." It couldn't be more true.

As far as how to know the effects of current, watch the "load" on your rods and your boards. They will tell you the speed of you baits better than any GPS. Know and understand what angle a 2oz wait slices into the water at different speeds. Learn the sound of the RPM's of the motor when trolling at an appropriate speed. Learn your gear and boat, and you will learn current. Watch the number on your GPS, and you will never understand current.

[Jim Stedke]

All good info. I like to think of a current as a river flowing through the lake. The fish don't want to be in the flow, but along the edge of it. Just like fish in a river, they want slack water (eddies) where the current is bringing food to them. So get to the edge of the current and work in line with it.

Scum lines or trash lines mark the edges of currents or where 2 currents flowing in opposite direction are rubbing shoulders. I always investigate significant scum lines. (at least check them w/ the fish finder).

I believe if one could know all there is to know about currents, it would let you know where to fish on any given day.

[Seaturd]

Now we're getting somewhere! Excellent info guys, I thank you.

[Jim Stedke]

Has anyone tried the new split rings that are egg shaped and have the split on the side where it can never effect the action of the lure?

[BlackH2odog]

The Cabela's Walleye Runner comes with this type of ring. They worked well for me this past November.

[Jim Stedke]

I'm not a fan of using a lure that is an obvious and direct copy of an other manufactures product, esspecially when one of the big box stores is doing it so that they can capture a huge mark up. It's like spitting in the face of what is right for the almighty dollar, and it just seems sort of unamerican to me.

I believe the egg shaped split rings would help with some of the tuning issues. The std split ring will center itself either on the lure loop or on the snap. When I've tuned lures in a pool and you can see them at 50' out, you can see that it does make a slight diference.

[Rik]

What determines what reef runner size or # to use.I will be useing them with an inline weight to control depth and mainly fishing out east.Do they have signifacant differences in how they wobble?I know they are known for there kick out action and some believe that triggers strikes.Do they all have this action?A lot of guys out east like the kabooms or thunderstick jrs and also the bomber 24a.I guess the 600 series RRs would best match these sizes.What is the favorite RR to use and what is the differnces between them other than diving depth since I will be mainly useing weights for the depth control.

[Jim Stedke]

There is a big diference inthe action of the 700 (more subtle) and the 800 (more open) and the 800s are the ones know for their kick out. The 400 Rip Shad would be a good choice if shad are the forage (when fishing inside 40'), the 500 Little Ripper would be the right lure to simulate young of the year smelt (more subtle action and a piece of worm on the back hook won't hurt), the 600 Dp Little Rippers would be closest to the 24 Bombers or the Kabooms.

I could see a time and place for all of them, but I don't know where and how you fish.

Probably 90% of our fish come on 800s because we seldom give the others a chance to prove their worth (our bad).

Hope this helps, come on Spring.

[BlackH2odog]

Jim, to add to your comment on the big mark-up for profit, one hooks on each of the two baits that I have broke on the third or fourth fish.

Interesting that they choose to use the oval split. Did they find the lure would not track with the standard split?

[Jim Stedke]

I seriously doubt it. They likely had an option and chose the oval.

[wajski]

Jim, have ever heard of a product called "the side winder" ? I saw this on Axtackle.com. It is a side planer used to take your line away from the boat.

[wallykiller]

What program would you run during the may/fish fly hatch? Is bait color a factor to consider during this time?

[Jim Stedke]

wajski, Yes I've heard of them, but honestly I don't remember (or know) that much about them. No experience with them.

[Jim Stedke]

Wallykiller, We run wide wobbling noisy lures, most often white based colors simulating the small white bass and white perch that are taking advatage of the hatch, and speed up sometimes to 2.5 mph trying to trigger reaction strikes. In the Reef Runner family 400s, 600s & 800s (rip shad, dp little ripper, & Reef Runner Dp Diver).

Small spoons w/brown on them (Mi Stinger mayfly) will also get bite. The fish flies in May normally don't have the impact of the mayflies in June. But te same tactics work.

[Mark Komo]

Hey, Jim, nice work. Thanks for the input.

I still have a few of my dad's (I am 45) old school balsa f9 and f11. I noticed he drilled a few holes and added a small split or something. Never really ran em. I imagine they dont do that any more, but back then I figure you couldnt get anything deep if you wanted to, ala, the weight forward spinner era. Also, seen a few cranks with what looks like solder wire around a few key spots. A quick 3 wraps or so.

I like to swap out hooks on a few models, depending on mono or firelining. Thinks that a waste of time, since the quality of the hook, at least on some models, seem to be getting better and better right out of the package? There are some sticky hooks out there.

[Jim Stedke]

Mark, I can remeber the articles that touted the benefits of modifying floating lures and making them suspend. Both lead wire and drilling and weighting where recommended. I'd bet your dads lures were suspenders, before they were available over the counter.

Good fishing and Come on Spring

[Bob Why]

Jim, I'll bet your right on the suspending baits. I remember doing the lead wraps on the hooks to get the bait to to sit tail down. Like this /. It was susposed to give a better hook up when bass fishing. Now for my question. I know you fish with your brother and a few others. Do you use their gear or your own? What do you use for tackle storage? As we've discussed in years past, that you never know when you'll need that one certain bait (color) that you left at home. When fishing on someone elses boat you can be limited on how much you bring. Even on my boat, I don't think I could fit all my tackle.

[Jim Stedke]

Bob,
Us boat whores have to be prepared. LOL

When I go on someone else's boat, I ask about rods, line type, boards, net and if it's early or late in the season, I'm pretty blunt about size age and condition of the rig.

A lot of times I have in the Prius: 3 rods, 3 right and 3 left hand boards, and a tackle bag w/ 4 or 5 3700 boxes with colors that have been working and the others that I think may be needed, rubber bands and wts, and a few magic markers. Key colors like chartruse, orange, pink, purple, blue, green and red.

With them I feel comfortable that I can modify moon eye monnow or pearl ghost or some other color into whatevr color I want.

A small cooler for food & drinks, thermos, rainsuit, life jacket and I'm good to go.

Speaking of going .... when are we gonna?

Come on Spring!!

[Bob Why]

I'm ready if the weather man will just cooperate. Will get in touch after ice off.

[tked1950]

[QUOTE=Jim Stedke;1145355]We use a #14 Crepe Rubber Band (they are red, tougher than the brown bands, and kinda slick). Sun doesn't deteriorate them as quick, and we use them to attach big board lines to the release clips as well. We sell them for $7.00 for 1/2 pound (about 600 bands).


Jim, I hate to keep bugging you on this, but, I've checked rubber bands at stores around here and have found at least 8 different #14 rubber band types. I don't have a clue as to which ones to buy. Can you help, please.

[Eastside Al]

i want to add my opinion to the baits Rik talked about in this thread out east talking about 600 reef runners and Jr's. i have found that once the mid summer heat comes that using the smaller baits like that of the smaller reefs and Jr's, that on my boat it seems that the farm animals start to like them even more, so i switch up to the 800's and reduce that chance. Take it though i still get a few but there usually big and a pain to real in. LOL When the little board sinks and stays down for a few seconds and everyone says we lost a board thats usually an indication its not a walleye, but then it could be a big eye. Its just nice to see the board go backwards, i hand the rod to the kids and say enjoy!

[Jim Stedke]

tked1950,

I know no other way to discribe them red and kind of slick. The rubber compound is called Crepe. They are the toughest to break. And withstand exposure to UV much better than the brown or tan ones.

Rich will ship you 1/2 # for 5 bucks plus the cost of postage. If your interested.

Later, Jim

[OhYeah]

Jim,
A friend told me about a fishing show he saw w/ Mark Romanoff fishing off Cranberry & touting Offshores Tadpole, in-line weight system. http://www.offshoretackle.com/OR36_2.html Supposed to eliminate alot of the wave surge vs traditional inline weights. Jim or anyone have experience with these ??

thanx
GR

[Jim Stedke]

Eastside Al,
That may qualify as cruel and unusual punishment!!! (I know I hate to crank them spinin blankety blanks in).

[Jim Stedke]

Gary, Mark and I played eith them last year, and caught fish, but without experience and confidence in the depth achieved, we both shyed away from them during the tournaments.

[Spaniel235]

Mike had them and talked about them at the NCA meeting last night.....could be one more thing to buy............

[Old Dawg]

Planning a trip up the w/o May 8 and plan to fish all week weather permitting. Will be fishing out of Huron. So what would be the best program to use at that time of year? Have lots of spinners, spoons, reef runners, hot & tots etc. Just looking for what some of you guys would use in that area.

[Jim Stedke]

Old Dawg,
You shouldn't have to run far and you can use harnesses or cranks either one. Get out in front of Cedar Point and head N, 36' right on out to 48'. If you catch the right weather you may get tired of catchin walleyes. Speeds around 1.3 - 1.5 for spinners & 1.8-2.1 for cranks.

If you see net flags, get to the outside of them and run past them fairly close. If they've been in for a while the fish use them like structure.

Good luck, you should have a ball.

[Syclone]

Jim,
Two questions

Why does gold color work?
How do I compensate for rod tip above the water when trolling? If the rod is 5 feet above the water is my crank 5 feet above the dive chart with the same line out?

Thanks

[wanderin_eyes]

I'm not sure of the gold. mabe due to catching the light.
as for the rod tip. I asked the same question. last year. Put the rod in the holder you are going to use and let line out til the lure is just in the water. reset the counter and start from there.

[Jim Stedke]

Syclone, The cold (or more lately copper) thing must show through the turbid water in a more natural color, is all I could guess.

I keep asking the fish why they preferr them, but they refuse to answer.

Line from the rod tip to the water is what you need to estimate (usually around 25' depending on the lure, your drop length and the boat's speed. And add that lengty to the books drop length, to get the right depth.

COME ON SPRING!!!

[wanderin_eyes]

Syclone, The cold (or more lately copper) thing must show through the turbid water in a more natural color, is all I could guess.

I keep asking the fish why they preferr them, but they refuse to answer.Line from the rod tip to the water is what you need to estimate (usually around 25' depending on the lure, your drop length and the boat's speed. And add that lengty to the books drop length, to get the right depth.

COME ON SPRING!!!


I keep asking them to Jim. I even take the home and "grill" them and they won't talk:D

I didn't mean to step on your toes about the rod question. I remember asking you last year at one point. Every now and then I get excited for knowing one. lol

Springs right around the corner!!

[Old Dawg]

It can be really confusing at times. We worry about how accurate our line counters are to make sure we are exactly the right distance back for the correct lure depth. But then we estimate how far our line drop is where it enters the water and add that "Estimate" to our line out. I'm starting to think that as long as I'm in the range +/- 15' of what the book says and the lure is running above the fish they are going to hit it.

[Jim Stedke]

Last year in particular (from late June on) you were better off being 10 - 15' above the marks.

My only logical explaination is that the fish you're catching are high enough that they sre shying away from the boat, and the deeper fish are marking.

But in any event, I do not think in exact terms ever....to me is all estimates and in the ball park type thinking. Speed too.

[Kino]

Hey Jim, what kind of luck did you have fishing the new Rapala Trolls To TT20??? Any favorite colors or tactics?

[Jim Stedke]

Kino,
When Rapala came out w/ the taildancers they irked me big time. To me it was like megabucks lure company needs to try and put their foot on the neck of an upstart lure company in Ohio.

So I own 0 Taildancer and 0 TT lures, and know 0 about them.

Also.... I'm well aware that this has 0 effect on Rapala.

[ErieRider]

Jim,
My feelings exactly. To see Scott set this up from years ago to what he has now is incredible. Plus the big thing is they catch more and bigger fish, more consistently. The day at the show me and Ken were talking to you and Rich , I believe we sat in on the seminar from a guy named Johnnie Candle. He said it himself when he was talking about selecting lures for tournament fishing, using his exact words He "does not know how reef runner did it but they made a lure that flat out catches fish" he also said when you walk into a bait shop in South Dakota "it looks like the wall of Cranberry Creek, loaded with reef runners" Again, often imitated never duplicated. Its now my main program and my size and numbers are through the roof! Dave

[wanderin_eyes]

Hey Jim, what kind of luck did you have fishing the new Rapala Trolls To TT20??? Any favorite colors or tactics?

I own 2 of the TT20. I think I pulled each one once last year trying to match a color I heard they they were hitting. I didn't have a hit. Thats not reallying giving them a chance but they seemed to pull ok. I fugured I would try because of the ease of 100' of line and it dives to 20'. but then figure line size and speed and if you want it shallower how much line then?

[fishon667]

Jim

One question and one comment

Generally fish out of Conneaut. What causes a dipsy to flop over and twist the line? Current, waves, - generally only on one side of boat

Fished out of Huron last 11-29-Never been there -did not know how to fish that area. Met a fisherman at the new launch ramp in the river I believe it was OGF member ELKHTR He told us where to go and how to use boards and lures in top 15 fow Thank You. We limited out and finished up right in the area you advised OLD DAWG to go. Cedar point was on our left,Kellys was straight ahead and we were in 45 fow. There is so much good info here . Thanks

[Jim Stedke]

fishon667,
Current can flip and spin up Dipsys, but most often it is caused by allowing the Dipsy to drop on a slack line while setting (in other words setting it too fast). We set them with the clicker on and try to keep a study drop speed determined by a study even clicker noise, and keep just a slight tension on the line.

Hope this helps, COPME ON SPRING!!!

[wallykiller]

Do you have a favorite rod for pulling in-line boards?

[Jim Stedke]

My favorite rods for pulling in-line boards are Shimano Tiloras there are 4 versions any of which would be awesom TLA 70 ML 8-15#, TLA 70 M 10-17#, 80 ML 8-17# 2 pc & 80 M 10-20# 2 pc. They kicker is they run around 70 bucks, and paired w/the Tekota reels they end up in the $250.00 each range .

They are many good board rods in the 30 dollar range, look for soft readable tips, lots of powre in the bottom 1/2, and a length that you are comfortable with from 7 - 8-1/2'.
The biggest dealis make sure they are all identical (same length, same action), that makes learning toread them easy.

My thoughts are spend a little more on the reel and a little less on the rod.

Good luck & COME ON SPRING!!!

[jshbuckeye]

The bite in March, around the Islands/Reefs The way I understand it is, it is basically ice fishing from a boat, any truth to that? My questions are what is the basic presentation? Do you anchor or drift? Popular baits, and usually how presented? are the feeding eyes usually stuck to the bottom or up in the water column?

[Jim Stedke]

What most guys do in the early Spring is drift (or use their electric trolling motor to simulate a drift) either on the reefs or in 12 - 20 feet of water off shore from Port Clinton West, using hair jigs or blade baits. They catch way more males than females.

To target females you need to get out in deeper water. If you find good marks in deep water over soft bottom, that are on or very near the bottom, you can do exactly as you stated "ice fish out of your boat", anchored, or on still days not anchored, or hovering w/ the trolling motor. When we did this years ago, our best lutes where big 1 oz ball head prop jigs, w/a stinger that we'd put minnows on, and pound the bottom.

Any and all ice lures will work, and we usually started with 1 guy using a perch spreader and minnows, in case the fish where spooky.

I have not jigged deep for females in probably 10... maybe 15 years.

We now troll cranks, as soon as we can get out, and target high scattered marks in the top 15' of water. The primary area is from Catawba West to the turn around buoy 22' of water and deeper, but I've caught fish off Marblehead as well.

The lures I use are 700 & 800 Reef Runners, deep & shallow Huskys and deep & shallow Rouges. I use the deep lures probably 85% of the time run from 15' - 85' back at 1.2 - 1.8 mph.

Colors are dependant on water clarity, dirty water (6-12" of visability) mudd minnow and Texas Red; 12 - 18" of vis. bright flourecent colors, 18" - 30" vis white based colors like Huckleberry, purple white tiger, Barbie, and the Naked or glass colors; cleaner than that and the metalic or prism lures will work.

The short version of ice out fishing. If you have more questions fire back.

Here's a copy / paste from the 1st year seminar:
My question is will you find bigger fish off the Islands or in front of the reefs trolling cranks.

This Spring open water is coming so late that the ice out jig bite may be almost over before many get access to the lake. There will be big fish caught off the islands, all around the reefs, 1/2 mile off the cliffs of Catawba, out by Green Island, and on and on.

So I quess the answer is yes to both places.

It's a matter of getting enough info to know where your best chance is. The folks at Happy Hooker won't know what's going on North of Kelleys Island, and the guys at Hyway Bait won't know what's happening near the Nuke Plant. I'm trying to say bait stores get regionalized. They know what's happening near by but I wouldn't look for solid information about an area 15 or 20 miles away. Not in the early Spring at least.

The reef complex is the draw. There are more fish in that area, so I'd say get over that way. The L shaped area formed by A B C D E F cans is 10 or more miles long and if you widen that line out to 1-1/2 or 2 miles you've got a large area to work. Too large to cover effectivly. So it's good to have some reliable firends who give you a starting point.

Now when your buddy tells you they smoked em yesterday 1/2 mile Northeast of C can . That doesn't mean you should go pound that spot and then bitch him out cause you didn't catch any. That means you should start looking 1 or 1-1/2 mile away as you approach, spend a little time scoping things out and set up on the best concentration of fish that you find. These fish are moving following bait and thay seldom stay put. So when I say starting point, I don't mean start fishing ... I mean start lookiing.

My plot trails from the Spring look like a 4 year old wondering in a pine forrest. Act like a beagle that has lost the bunnies scent. Loop out 1 way ... then an other. If 1 area cools off, go find a different one. Spring trolling is seldom fast fishing, and 1 pull back an hour is a fairly good day, but keep in mind you are on top of the best concentration of oversized fish, that anyone has the opportunity to work all season long. And the next bite may be an 11, 12 13 pounder or larger. Stay focused and be patient.

Good luck. (man talking about it makes me want to go.)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Read more: http://www.ohiogamefishing.com/community/showthread.php?p=425556&highlight=early+spring+trolling#post425556#ixzz1Dq 2PTnrv

Good luck and come on Spring!!!

[jshbuckeye]

Thanks for the info and the other link.

[Bob Why]

Hey Jim, what kind of luck did you have fishing the new Rapala Trolls To TT20??? Any favorite colors or tactics?

I own at least one of each color of the TT15 and TT20 Minnow baits. I found them to be effective in early spring off of Catawba as well as all year in the Lorain/Vermilion area as well as Cleveland last year. My best colors were Hot Tiger, Fire Tiger, Blue Steel and Blue Silver. Fished the TT15's mostly. As Jim knows I'm a lure junkie and should join FLA. (Fishing Lures Annonomous) I worked at Dick's in Akron from 1995 when they opened until 2005. I always bought all the new stuff to try so that I could give the customers an honest opinion. Just can't seem to break that habit. I have to try anything new.

[Jim Stedke]

Just one of the many symptoms of the dreader fishing pox.

COME ON SPRING!!!

[Old Dawg]

What size spoons and best colors for 2nd week of May? Will be trolling Reef Runner 800's and spinners, but was wondering about spoons for that same time period. Do they produce in the spring or are they best used in the fall?

[Jim Stedke]

Spoons come on strong when the young of the year forage species get big enough to enter the food chain. That is around late May to early June, but spoons can work earlier if you want to give them a shot.

Most run smallers spoons such as Michigan Stinger scorpions, colors are pretty much the same as the cranks, and in fact some of the better crank colors are copies of spoon colors and visa/versa.

Good luck, and realize you can catch these fish any way you want, if you take time to dial in and refine that presentation.

COME ON SPRING!!!

[Thompson240]

I own at least one of each color of the TT15 and TT20 Minnow baits....

I see they have a yellow perch pattern. Have you used that pattern and if so with what results? Thanks.

[Walleye Wacker]

What are typically the best time to run darker colored lures and the best time to run bright colored lures. Ive heard fly fishing that the darker or dingyer colored water, the darker color lures work better and vise versa for bright colors. Is that typically the same for walleye on the lake. Thanks. :T:T

[Jim Stedke]

In water 6-8" of clarity the darker lures are better (actually my go tos are mud minnow & Texas Red), in cleaner 8-18" of clarity flourecent colors on the lure or key, 18-28" white based or naked colors, 28 - 36" prism flash colors, and more than 3' the metalics (but I don't likechromed bills).

The bare nakeds (or glass colors) work well in all but the dirtiest water.

Under 6" of visability and I loose interest fast.

[Bob Why]

I see they have a yellow perch pattern. Have you used that pattern and if so with what results? Thanks.

I'm not sure if I ran that pattern or not. A couple of colors I didn't pick up until near the end of Sep and I didn't fish much after that. I probably have a 100 plugs that have never seen water, as like everyone else I have my go tos and they are what I start with. If they produce I don't change. If they don't produce then I start going through the others.

[Thompson240]

Thanks for the reply on that Bob Why. I ordered 1 TT15 and 1 TT20 in the perch and 2 of the TT15's in fire tigers today. Can't wait to try them this year. I hope to get away from boating 20 sheep to 5 eye's this year by not running all my lines with meat and spinners. Last year I was running 4 lines all spinners and worms and I had all 4 lines drop back at the same time on the 36/36 line area mid summer. They were all sheep. I just couldn't find water not filled up with sheep it seemed. Fun but unproductive.

Good fishing to you in 2011!

[Bob Why]

Unfortunately cranks catch sheephead to. As do spoons.

[Wild Blue]

Jim I was told you do a crank bait presentation at the sport show in clevland. Ihave not been able to find any information on this. Any help on infomation I'll be there. Thank you Ron Gray

[Jim Stedke]

Ron, The seminars I do are at the Cleveland Boat Show in Jan. Sorry!!

But This thread is all about answeing questions, and I'd be glad to answer questions you may have.

Or do a search, this is the 5th year for this mid-winter seminar and they are all still accessable, so searches will provide ample reading opportunities.

Good Luck.

[Triton20]

Hello Jim, do you use dual lock snaps on your reef runners or do you tie directly to the split ring?

[Walleye Wacker]

Dual Locks all the way. Spoons use snap swivels.

[Jim Stedke]

Triton20,
Duolock about 5/8ths" for cranks. Tune em and you don't need a swivel.

The leaders for harnesses or spoons have a Sampo ballbearing snap swivel on one end and the duolock on the other and are tied on 20 or 25# Flourocarbon leader material that is stiff enough to resist twisting.

Hope this helps, COME ON SPRING !!!

[Triton20]

Good deal! I will continue to tune my cranks, never have liked using them. What size sampo and duolock do you use for your harnesses? Thanks for the help.

[Jim Stedke]

#2 on the Samps & 5/8ths " on the doulocks. good luck

[BOILERWOLF]

Jim, thanks for all the valuable information. This is my 3rd winter following your seminar and I learn something all the time. Some of your comments I even remember from past years. Maybe it is starting to sink in!

We had a good year in 2010 fishing in Western Basin using crank baits most of the time - Reef Runners & Hot-N-Tots. Caught walleye in August when most were fishing for perch - not many but some every trip out. Because of business I'm in (Agriculture), distance to lake (225 miles) and a$$hole I work for, fishing in April, May, June and October is almost impossible for us. End of June, July, August and early September are when we can get on lake but WE HAVE A BLAST!

I am self employed and know that A$$hole I work for very well. Thanks again for all the information and keep spoon feeding this dumb farm boy from central Indiana.

[Jim Stedke]

Glad someone is listening. Have you tried the larger Rip Shads or the deep little ripppers for the summer west end eyes??

If you have trouble w/ weeds after some wind, try cinching a rubber band on your line 6' ahead of the lure. That will catch the first few weeds, and give the lure a better chance to get hit. You still have to clean em, but only every 20 minutes instead of every 10.

Let me know if I can help.

[MDBuckeye]

What series of RR do you run the most in the Spring? I know last Spring, which was my first in 15+ years on Erie we ran more of the 600 series. Is there a time in which you switch from 800's to 600's and such?

Thanks!

[Jim Stedke]

I run 800s most of the time. My brother on the charter boat runs 800s ALL the time. (they slide down the tow line better) From mid May to mid June the smaller lures will catch (sometimes better than the larger ones), but often nontarget species become an issue.

Use what you have confidence in, but if too many white bass and/or white perch are encountered ...go to a larger lure.

Good luck and COME ON SPRING!!!

[BOILERWOLF]

Glad someone is listening. Have you tried the larger Rip Shads or the deep little ripppers for the summer west end eyes??

If you have trouble w/ weeds after some wind, try cinching a rubber band on your line 6' ahead of the lure. That will catch the first few weeds, and give the lure a better chance to get hit. You still have to clean em, but only every 20 minutes instead of every 10.

Let me know if I can help.

Jim - we have some little rippers on boat & caught fish on them last year. However when it gets slow we tend to go back to 800 series Reef Runners in our "go to" colors.

When the staff at Happy Hooker see me come in the door you can see the "sparkle" in thier eyes. I almost ALWAYS buy what they tell me is working and of course you need two or three in case it is really hot and/or you lose one. We use a fork truck to load Reef Runner tackle box on boat!:) This website has also increased my number of Reef Runners!

Question on speed. How slow do you go trolling RR? Normally our best action has been 2.5 to 3.0 mph with very little success at 2.0 mph. At slow speed are we losing to much of that special RR action?

Thanks again,

[Jim Stedke]

Good question! And like most good question the real answer is.."well that all depends".

I know guys who catch on Reefs at 1 mph or less, names like Travis Hartman, and EZmarc...guys who know what they're doin.

I only run them under 1.8 in extremely cold water, and most of the time I'm at 2.5 & up. If you're running them at 3 you've got the tuning thing whipped, because they've got to be right on the tolerate that kinda speed.

So far as why you're not able to catch at 2, I think it has more to do w/ water temps, then lack of the kick-out action. Your faster speeds are causing a reaction strike, triggering the preditory instinct, like a cat that is not hungry, attacking a mouse, just because the mouse ran.

The other thing that changes at real slow speeds is the dive curve. The slower you go the flater the dive curve (or the slower you go the shallower the lure runs). Reef Runners aren't real bad about this because they are not super bouyant. Huskys are much more bouyant and therefore show a greater effect.

Happy Hooker sold a ton of the larger Rip Shads last year. I'm surprised they didn't talk you into some of them.

I'm like you...I like to go fast. Speed kills. If it ain't broke ...don't fix it.

COME ON SPRING!!!

[WBSA]

Jim - we have some little rippers on boat & caught fish on them last year. However when it gets slow we tend to go back to 800 series Reef Runners in our "go to" colors.

When the staff at Happy Hooker see me come in the door you can see the "sparkle" in thier eyes. I almost ALWAYS buy what they tell me is working and of course you need two or three in case it is really hot and/or you lose one. We use a fork truck to load Reef Runner tackle box on boat!:) This website has also increased my number of Reef Runners!

Question on speed. How slow do you go trolling RR? Normally our best action has been 2.5 to 3.0 mph with very little success at 2.0 mph. At slow speed are we losing to much of that special RR action?

Thanks again,

I love the slow troll (all year) and some times get in the .5 range and even create stalls that practicaly stop the bait from moving at all. Works well for me anyway. It is exasperatingly boring at times though. You gotta have faith, I guess.

However 2010 was a Stedke, speed kills, year for me. I did more 3.0 crank trolling than ever before, mainly bercause that's what the fish seemed to prefer, especialliy in the dog days of summer east of Kelleys. RR 800 were my most used but I usually have a couple other brands out as well.

I've gotten lazy with the work that worm fishing creates in the last couple years and you'll rarely get them 50 fish days with cranks (2 guys) but lazy is ok with me.

Oops, didn't realize I was logged in as WBSA

Ezmarc

[Old Dawg]

Jim, I'm in the market for a dozen or more of the newer Reef Runners, but the number of existing colors out there have my mind running in circles. Soooooooo, if you were going to buy 12 or so of the new RR's what colors would be your preference?

[Jim Stedke]

Old Dawg, It would help me to know when (what months) and where (what part of the lake). I'd be happy to assist.

[Old Dawg]

Jim, I'm looking at the May/June and October/ early November time frames. Area of the lake would be from Vermillon to Kelly's island.

[Jim Stedke]

Your sharing water w/ me, here's 12 good ones:

Purple white tiger, Purple barly naked, pearl ghost, Barbie, Eriedescent, Salmon, white blue back, rainbow trout, Bubble gum, Pink panties bare naked, Spotted sunset, Wild thing.

And for fall add Dry ice.

[normd]

Your sharing water w/ me, here's 12 good ones:

Purple white tiger, Purple barly naked, pearl ghost, Barbie, Eriedescent, Salmon, white blue back, rainbow trout, Bubble gum, Pink panties bare naked, Spotted sunset, Wild thing.

And for fall add Dry ice.


Salmon? Have not see that one, got a pic? Do you mean Salamander?

[flylogicsteelhead]

I would pick six of those colors and buy at least two of each. I found myself kicking my self in the butt for only having one of something producing too many times. As mentioned earlier after I fished with Jim at the Islands I carry a set of Permanent 24 colors or so markers for that reason.

[Jim Stedke]

normd, Salmon is rainbow trout only with a green back instead of blue.

[Jim Stedke]

I would pick six of those colors and buy at least two of each. I found myself kicking my self in the butt for only having one of something producing too many times. As mentioned earlier after I fished with Jim at the Islands I carry a set of Permanent 24 colors or so markers for that reason.

OGM I can't believe you let the COB (cat outa the bag). LOL

I do carry a zip lock bag of permanent markers to simulate colors. And it has come in handy on several occassions. If you had just chartruse, pink, purple, green, blue, red, black & orange, you could add those colors which are often key.

COME ON SPRING !!!

[MDBuckeye]

Your sharing water w/ me, here's 12 good ones:

Purple white tiger, Purple barly naked, pearl ghost, Barbie, Eriedescent, Salmon, white blue back, rainbow trout, Bubble gum, Pink panties bare naked, Spotted sunset, Wild thing.

And for fall add Dry ice.

Jim - Same with late March and April as far as colors?
I am trying to get my trolling arsenal together and don't have many RR's yet so pretty much starting from scratch.

I'm fishing a little boat (16.5 ft FisherHawk w 90 Merc and 9.9 kicker) though so may want to stick close early Spring with the jig bite, but man do I want to catch a HOG in my own boat.

Thanks!

[Jim Stedke]

MDBuckeye, Early Spring fishing is nearly always stained water fishing. So I'm assuming water clarity of no more than 24".

Purple white tiger, Purple barely naked, pearl ghost, Barbie, Eriedescent or Eriely naked, white w/ blue back, Emerald shiner, Bubble gum, Pink panties or the bare naked version, Chartruse headed wonderbread, blue headed wonderbread (a glow belly lure), and any other bare naked that looks good to you.

For early spring trolling I only take 700 & 800 Reef Runners, deep & shallow Rouges & dp & shallow Huskys. The dp gold rouge has done well for me and won 1 of the April PWTs for Jim Peterson 10 or 12 years ago.

If you catch a fish pay attention to the belly color (pink, orange, Char, or white), that seems to be a key for cold water.

Fish in the top 15', and expect the fish to be stacked in the dirtiest water. Thet are there for the slightly warmer temps and are as negative a fish as I know of. Troll in areas where you see higher scattered marks.

Good luck & COME ON SPRING.

[Dan]

I have been learning a great deal from this thread as well as many others, thank you all.

I was wondering if you could give me some insight to how far from the boat you would run big boards and how that might vary depending on the season, lure, day or night etc.
Feel free to overstate the obvious I'm learning:D

[Jim Stedke]

Dan, Distance out for big boards is determined more by wave heigth, number of rods to be run and traffic, more than anything else. Board performance, (how well they pull) also must be taken into account, but we're going to assume you have good boards.

Most guys run 3 lines a side and have 150' of tow line. If it's calm with few boats you can run them all the way out, but most would use 125' of line for 3 rods and only push them all the way out when they want to run 4 rods on each side.

Feel free to come back for more. Good luck, & COME ON SPRING !!!

With big boards you have releases that slide down the tow line, and hard pulling (deep diving) lures make setting lines easier.

You see only a few boats night fishing w/ big boards (most use in-lines), and with traffic you must shorten them up (80' or so).

[Wishin4Fishin]

Jim,

I am new to the forum but have been lurking for nearly a year. I've read every post in this thread as well as last years thread. Just started walleye fishing last year and have been a sponge soaking up all the information you have been generous enough to dish out.

I noticed you mentioned "The leaders for harnesses or spoons have a Sampo ballbearing snap swivel on one end and the duolock on the other and are tied on 20 or 25# Flourocarbon leader material that is stiff enough to resist twisting." I'm assuming this is in reference to using a shorter harness (24" or so)? Can you just tie the harness longer (6' of so) and simply have the duo lock on one end and the snelled harness on the other? The duo lock would attach directly to the ball bearing swivel on a jet? I guess a benefit of using a leader would the ability to transform a casting harness into a trolling harness? Do you prefer trolling spoons and harnesses behind jets or dipseys?

Please pardon the question if I am totally in left field. We worked a lot last fall with reef runners and feel very confident in that area but looking to expand our arsenal this year.

[Jim Stedke]

The harnesses I was referring to were shorter (like 10 or 11") and made to be run w/ a leader. The 6' harnesses for in line wts would work but the leaders are typically not hard mono and if you go too fast they'll twist up.

If I'm east of Fairport, I'd like pull harnesses. West of Cleveland spoons, and I fish Dipsys more than Jets, because they are easier to read (especially when those pesky white perch & white bass are thick).

By the way the swivels on Jets and Dipsys are not ballbearing, and I'd have a ballbearing somewhere in the system.

Good luck & COME ON SPRING !!!

[eyewannago]

Jim is this weather were having now help the SPRING FEVER symptoms?????? Jim do you think the rubber bands that Rich uses would work on planer boards? Joe

[Jim Stedke]

Yea right!!! 4" of snow on the ground w/ 4 - 6" more forecast,.... That's just the perfect medicine for my Spring fever (if you're tryung to make it as bad as possible).

If you mean for reducing surge in bigger waves, no. If you mean giving you something more to read, no. If you mean to use as a spring for tattle flags, yes they'd work for that and hold up better than brown ones, but you'd have to experiment to determine the right tension.

COME ON SPRING!!!

[926bill]

:TGood morning Jim,I've got one quick question. I just bought four offshore boards and they have the or19 clips on them both front and back. I've got 30# power pro line on my reels, and from playing with them in the shop I'll need to double wrap them to keep the board from sliding. Can I get away with this or do I need the expensive or18 locking clips?
I just got a boat last summer and trying to get all set up before spring. Great information, I'm learning a bunch. Thanks.
BChttp://www.ohiogamefishing.com/photopost/data/2/thumbs/Boat_0121.JPG ('http://www.ohiogamefishing.com/photopost/data/2/Boat_0121.JPG')

[Jim Stedke]

296bill,

Double wrapping will work, but my guess is that you'll end up getting the OR19 clips for the front only. chasing boards takes all the fun out of it, and double wrapping is a hastle.

Word of advise...make sure you do not pull your powerpro through the clips when closed. To do so creates a slot in the pads, causing the need for replacment.

good luck.

[BASS ACKWARDS]

Jim love all the info, was wondering what lb mono or braided line you use for your line counters, didn't see anything or i missed it on seminar page and thanks again!!!

[Jim Stedke]

On my board rods I run 12# Berkley Big Game. On my Dipsys reels I run 40# Power Pro.

I play around with 30' of 10/4 Fireline on a couple mono rods in the spring, but it's gone by mid May. Some days the added action on the fireline lures produces more bites.

[MDBuckeye]

One question regarding RR's...
Can 700's be used with weight, dipsey's, or jets the same as 800's without?

I am aware that the dive angle is much more on the 800's but if you used any other kind of weight or depth aid for the 700 series would you think they would work similar?

Thanks!

[Wishin4Fishin]

Jim,

I was reading the thread regarding in line board retreival and saw where K gone metioned "another reason why proper board spacing is so important." This got me thinking. How do you space your in line boards? How much line do you let out once the board is clipped on for your outside board? Then what is the difference between the outside and middle boards? I would then assume the differnce would be the same between the middle and inside board?

Thanks,

Justin

[fishon667]

Jim We are going to try Church Walleye boards in this area of the lake. We will be running two rods on each side of the boat with RR 800 and harnesses.
What size line-how far back -weight?- SAy 72-75 fow and fish are marking at 40 - 50 ft. With dipseys we know what we are doing- with boards the only time we used them was late last fall at Huron in top 15 fow with no weight for RR's. I remember you like to fish high in the water on outside board. Would this work here? Thanks

Bill

[Jim Stedke]

MDBuckeye, The action is much different. I wouldn't think performance would be interchangable. We do fish 700s behind Dipsys quite a bit in the late summer, but it is not in an attempt to duplicate 800s.

[Jim Stedke]

Wishin4Fishin, I pay no attention to the line counter after hooking on the board, but I would guess the dif is from 25'-40' depending on how rough it is and how far out we're running the boards.

[Jim Stedke]

Fishon667, 800 back 200' is 28' w/3ozs ahead + 12-15' (depending on speed & assuming speeds around 2 mph) would put the lure around 43' dp.

High fish are always a possibility Rizzman had some success over that way last summer w/ high cranks....worth a shot.

Good luck Jim

[rizzman]

Fishon667,
I have never really had much luck targeting those fish 45+ ft. down when fishing out east. Some guys can really go out there and smash'em on a regular basis, I guess i'm just a slow learner. I usually run 6 + rods, I have had much better luck going after those fish in the top 25ft. even on those dog days in late summer. I run two riggers down deep, the rest are up high. You wont mark alot up high but they are there.... Good luck. (The Stedke rule)

[Eastside Al]

Follow Jim's guide but go back to 240 and just a 1oz 800 reef, we talked before on anoher thread and that should get you 38-40. Do remember that the water is so clear you wont mark many fish up high. This tactic was really good for my boat last year. Good Luck.

[Jim Stedke]

Al, What we most often do is use a different wt on each side, like 1-1/2 oz on the starboard side, and set 2 outside line back 200' & the 2 inside lines back 180'.

Then on the port side use 2oz wts, with the outside 2 lines back 240' and the inside 2 back 220'.

That lets you cover a thicker band of water, and many days you don't need to go to just one wt and drop length, just fish with the variations, and move them all up or down only if the marks move.

Sinkers make depth achieved a very nonprecise science. Wave ht., currents & how straight you drive, have much to do with depth achieved. And I have a tendency to think that the long the lure has been in the lake the deeper it gets. That is to say that the inside lures go deeper on every turn, and with the sinkers they don't quite get back up to the original depth, once you straighten out.

Thanks for the added input, your post baited me into thinking about what I would actually do.... FISH ON !!!

WELCOME MARCH !!!

[fishon667]

Jim

Thanks to all for that feedback. But what about harnesses?- How much weight do I need for say 25 ft and 40 ft down?

My fishing buddy Tom ties all our harnesses and last year he started putting a spoon a foot in front of the harness in the same color pattern. We caught 90% of all our fish on these. I dont think this is new but is sure did work last year.

Thanks again- Sassy Sal on radio

[Jim Stedke]

There are several guys here that are into harnesses much more than me, and I'll deferr to them (Kgone, Blue Dolphin ETAL)

[rockytop]

Jim

Thanks to all for that feedback. But what about harnesses?- How much weight do I need for say 25 ft and 40 ft down?

My fishing buddy Tom ties all our harnesses and last year he started putting a spoon a foot in front of the harness in the same color pattern. We caught 90% of all our fish on these. I dont think this is new but is sure did work last year.

Thanks again- Sassy Sal on radio

your speed should be 1.5 not much faster. a 3oz weight 50 to 60 back puts you at 24 foot, 3 oz 90 to 100 back puts you 42 down. also dont stay with somthing long if your not picking fish and you know the fish are there. get out the dipsys somthing you have confidance in. here is a local made in ohio inline weights. http://www.rednekoutfitters.com/ at the top of the site click depth chart.

[fishon667]

Rockytop

Thanks for that info-I've already printed that page-those are good looking trolling weights

[Walleye Wells]

Jim,
When running harnesses, have you seen a preference for gold, copper, or silver backed colorado blades? I know you don't use harnesses too much so, anybody can feel free to answer. If it helps with answering, I primarily fish off the west end of the lake and don't normally travel much further east than Kelley's. I start fishing the jig bite and then proceed fishing the rest of the year.

Thanks for an answer and all of the great information in these seminars,

Brandon

[Jim Stedke]

Copper, gold, then silver, and I like the hammered or diamond cut versions. And to complicate matters, more and more are producing painted back blades and some are painting the back to match the front side.

Thank goodness the fish are not as picky as the fishermen.

[Hetfieldinn]

Jim,
When running harnesses, have you seen a preference for gold, copper, or silver backed colorado blades? I know you don't use harnesses too much so, anybody can feel free to answer. If it helps with answering, I primarily fish off the west end of the lake and don't normally travel much further east than Kelley's.

Gold backs and, or, painted backs definitely do better, for me anyways, in that area. I'm pretty sure I didn't use a copper backed blade once last year, in any part of the lake.

[Jim Stedke]

OK all you spinner guys. What's you take on the back side of a blade....more or less important than the front side?

I ask because copper spoons are the big sellers and it seems that gold blades do better.

That leads to the question does a walleye precieve and/or approach a harness different than a spoon.

My take would be... yes the slower speeds w/ harnesses and the scent of the worm makes it more likely for a walleye to follow or approach from directly behind the lure. Whereas a spoon, pulled at a faster speed is more likely to be attached from the side or from below.

All this makes it seem like the back side of a blade may be more important than the back side of a spoon.

Agree...disagree....comments.

[Bob Why]

Jim, I think as in all of our presentations. It depends on the fishes mood and the day.
Most of our cranks are painted (plated) all over. There are times when those silver lures seem to be the only thing that will catch fish. When spoon fishing there have been times that the Blueberry Muffin (Chartreause Back) was the main thing the eyes would take. White back spoons sometimes seem to be preferred. And I've had times that purple back was the hot one. The only one that I don't fish much anymore is the silver back on spoons or blades. Not that it doesn't catch fish, but because everyone says gold, copper or painted backs are the hot producing ones. During one tourney a couple of years ago, one of the guys was using a silver back Tourney Winner Michigan Stinger and catching more than the other guys on the boat. None of us thought about the silver back but were trying to match the front. I never thought about that until now. Maybe another color with a silver back would have done better. Or just like out on the sandbar, on the east side they are taking a blue/yellow thing-a-ma-jig with a gold back and on the west side of the bar they won't touch it but want a shrimp colored dohickey with a black back. And that is why we call it fishing. There is to much on here sometimes that we take as the only thing to use or do. Or we go to a spot that someone has posted they did good at and we get skunked and think the person that posted those numbers was telling a fib. Not thinking that he posted it yesterday on what he did the day before. How far could those fish have moved? Come on spring.

[fishingguy]

Well Jim, this spinner guy figures that if you fish where there are fish, go the right speed, at the right depth, than the color of the backside of the blade becomes relevant. And yes, I do believe it to be more important than the top side. My inventory says I like chartreuse backs the best. Need to order more of them. Orange, green, gold and purple backs seem to be favorites also. If I catch a fish with a gold back with a perch pattern top, I don't go searching for a perch pattern top, I search for another gold back blade. If I can figure out the first sentence of this post when out fishing, choosing colors is easy, a lot of them will work. Also, I am starting to think that bead color to be more important than the top color on the blade. I think the beads would look like the belly of the bait fish to a walleye. I figure the color of the belly on a crankbait to be important, than why not have the beads match those colors. All chartreuse, gold, orange or whatever?

[Jim Stedke]

Fishingguy, Good point, but I only pay close attention to belly color in the Spring....go figure, I have no idea why that is, but it's the truth.

[goolies]

Jim,

Jig fishing in the Spring seems to be the hot ticket for walleye in the western basin. What prey is the jig imitating?

Thanks
Andy

[Jim Stedke]

Andy, Walleyes are preditors, if they see it, sense valnerabilty, and it will fit in their mouth, they will try to eat it. I'd guess that goobies would be the prey item most closly simulated, but their more greyish-brownish-green.

What's in the lake that looks like Barbie, pink panties, or monkey puke??? nothin.


I believe they are trying to take advantage of a precieved feeding opportuity, without asking questions. Or checking their field guide to prey species.

Thanks for the question, and good luck.

By the way....most of the time I'll be trolling for the females while the hot jig bite is going on.

[goolies]

Andy, Walleyes are preditors, if they see it, sense valnerabilty, and it will fit in their mouth, they will try to eat it. I'd guess that goobies would be the prey item most closly simulated, but their more greyish-brownish-green.

What's in the lake that looks like Barbie, pink panties, or monkey puke??? nothin.


I believe they are trying to take advantage of a precieved feeding opportuity, without asking questions. Or checking their field guide to prey species.

Thanks for the question, and good luck.

By the way....most of the time I'll be trolling for the females while the hot jig bite is going on.

Thanks Jim. You know I always have found it hard to believe that walleye mistake a spinner and crawler for natural prey...and that bass perceive a buzz bait as as prey..and so on. I plan on coming out west this April for the first time to jig fish. I also plan on trolling for the big girls while out there. Come on Spring!

[Buckeye Ron]

By the way....most of the time I'll be trolling for the females while the hot jig bite is going on.[/QUOTE]

Jim,
What size RR will you be running in the early spring??
Thanks,
Ron

[Jim Stedke]

Ron, In the Early Spring I have 800s, 700s, Dp & shallow Huskys and dp & shallow Rouges, plus some Renowski glass colors, and some misc. minnow lures.

Mostly 800s and dp Rouges

[Fish Scalper]

The jig imitates the sound of a females eggs dropping on the bottom. The males swarm to the sound of it; they're not as hungry as they are horny and extremely competitive to locate the objects of their lust!

[cw261]

The jig imitates the sound of a females eggs dropping on the bottom. The males swarm to the sound of it; they're not as hungry as they are horny and extremely competitive to locate the objects of their lust!

You will be able to see evidence of this when you get the fish in the boat:D

[Jim Stedke]

You're best off to turn the belly of the fish away from you (towards your buddy) before grapping them to remove the hook.

In Het's boat .... just let Het take em off.It's too complicated to explain.

[KaGee]

In the extreme Western Basin our go-to blades have been Happy Hooker and Pink Panties and are both copper backed.

[FreeByrdSteve]

Thanks for participating in our fishing seminar and open house today jim.

[Jim Stedke]

Thanks for the invite....always a good time.

[Jim Stedke]

One of the more interesting facts that surfaced on Sat. was Travis's comment aboout the creel surveys in the Fenwick area last Spring. These surveys also included sexing of all fish included, and of the 500 plus fish surveyed, only 2 were females.

20 years ago we fished the spawning reefs. Several days we were catching fish while they were actively spawning (we knew they were spawning because the females were rolling on the surface). During the 8 or 10 yrs we worked the reefs, we caught hundreds of walleyes, casting Fuzzy Grugs w/ a minnow or 1/4 oz jig hds w/ a 4" curl tail. In all those trips we never caught a single female...not 1. We snaged a couple, but never ever had 1 bite.

My feeling is the females on or near the reefs are so preoccupied with spawning that they will not eat.

The creel survey guys never got to check any trollers catches, which I can assure you would have included females. It seems to me that early most of the trollers catches would be females, and as April unfolds, more and more males will be caught by trollers.

This tread seems to be kinda stalled out, so I thought I'd give it a kick.

Daylight saving time start March 13th.

[bocajemma]

Heres on for you. I don't troll often, but when I do part of my program usually involves dipseys with spoons. Up till now I have been using 30lb mono down to the dipsey and then a 20lb fluoro leader. Of course with the stretch of the mono you sometimes have issue with getting the dipsey to trip when you get a strike or you have to set it so light that you get nuisance trips. Planning on switching to braid down to the dipseys and still use a fluoro leader, but then most advise using a snubber after the dipsey if you use braid down to the dipsey. isn't the snubber counter productive to what you are trying to acheive, which is having the dipsey trip when you get a strike?

[Jim Stedke]

We use 40# Powerpro to the Dipsy. The snubber goes behind the Dipsy (or between the Dipsy & the leader) to provide some cushion to the bigger eyes and whatever else needs it.

By being behind the Dipsy, there is no interferance w/ the trip.

Try setting your trip tension at 2-1/2 pounds for calm water. And increase it just slightly for rougher water. (use your fish scale in the big loop on the release wire to determine trip tension).

Only big fish trip the Dipsys by themselves. The idea is trip it smoothly and still have the fish hooked up when you're done.

When tripping the Dipsy, crank the rod tip down so the rod is parrallel to the water. Thumb the reel spool to defeat the drag, and give a short sharp pop to the rod. If the Dipsy trips, you will absolutely know it.

If you don't feel it trip, don't yank harder, just hold the rod and watch the line. If the line angle starts to come higher, the Dipsy is tripped, and yanking harder would only rip the hooks out of the fish.

You will be amazed how much easier it is to see little fish on the Dipsys. You are absolutely doing the best thing you could do to improve your Dipsy rods output.

Thanks for the question, and good luck.

[ErieRider]

Jim,
I know somewhere it was covered and I have done it in the past but since we are on the topic and since I only fish with them a few times a year can you just give a recap on how to properly speed set a dipsy.

[Jim Stedke]

Dave, Here ya go:

Let’s say we are setting either the 2, 3 or 4 Dipsy on the port side of the boat. Start by going to the far starboard side and drop the Dipsy in the lake as far out as possible (but not over any lines on that side). Check to make sure the spoon lure or harness is not tangled and the leader is not wrapped around the Dipsy. Then turn on the clicker, thumb the spool lightly and drop the Dipsy in the lake. Hold the rod high and pointing out to the right while allowing the line to come off the spool, at a fairly fast and study rate using the clicker to make sure there is no slack line to the Dipsy. When you get ¾ of your desired drop length in the lake walk over to the Port side, and hold the rod near the proper holder. When the line counter reaches you drop length, engage the spool, and insert the rod into the holder.

The Dipsy will pull over to the left and the line resistance will raise it up and over the inside lines.

The boat must be held on course (no turning). And if one of the Dipsys inside the one you are setting fires you must trip the one you are setting and start over. The hooked fish will bring it’s Dipsy up into the path of the one you are setting. Strong cross currents can also mess up the works.

This is much easier to show someone, then it is to explain in words, but with practice It not that complicated.

Hope this helps. Jim

[ErieRider]

Jim, Got it. Its been a long winter and needed refreshing. I remember the process now that you describe it. I just could not remember where on the boat to be to start setting the line. i am good, thanks a million.

[bocajemma]

I have a question about current and the spring jig bite. Is there any relation to current and structure during the spring jig bite? I know that after the spawn while feeding current is very important in the location and activity of the walleyes. Is there any tendency during the spawn to catch more fish on the upwind/current side of the structure or points jigging or on the downwind/current side? I just have never heard any discussion on current during the jig bite and wondered if it made any difference.

[Jim Stedke]

Most of time you want to be on the better structure on the up current side. The trick is the current running today is dependant up what the wind has done in the past 24 - 60 hours. And it takes 12 - 24 hours for a wind change to redirect the currents.

Make several exploritory drifts across the reef or break looking for fish and work the better concentrations.

Good luck.

[Kino]

Hey Jim what are some or your favorite size and colors of deep and shallow rouges and huskys?? We ask and talk alot about Reef Runners but not much love for the others!

[BOILERWOLF]

Your post on creel check at Fenwick was very interesting concerning percentage of males. My question to you is the "hogs" you catch trolling in spring are mainly all female so have they already spawned or are they heading to reefs to spawn? I assume they have spawned and back on a "feeding" binge in the deeper water.

I'm not asking to create negative posts on releasing females that have not spawned - just curious.

Thanks!

[Workdog]

Dave, Here ya go:

Let’s say we are setting either the 2, 3 or 4 Dipsy on the port side of the boat. Start by going to the far starboard side and drop the Dipsy in the lake as far out as possible (but not over any lines on that side). Check to make sure the spoon lure or harness is not tangled and the leader is not wrapped around the Dipsy. Then turn on the clicker, thumb the spool lightly and drop the Dipsy in the lake. Hold the rod high and pointing out to the right while allowing the line to come off the spool, at a fairly fast and study rate using the clicker to make sure there is no slack line to the Dipsy. When you get ¾ of your desired drop length in the lake walk over to the Port side, and hold the rod near the proper holder. When the line counter reaches you drop length, engage the spool, and insert the rod into the holder.

The Dipsy will pull over to the left and the line resistance will raise it up and over the inside lines.

The boat must be held on course (no turning). And if one of the Dipsys inside the one you are setting fires you must trip the one you are setting and start over. The hooked fish will bring it’s Dipsy up into the path of the one you are setting. Strong cross currents can also mess up the works.

This is much easier to show someone, then it is to explain in words, but with practice It not that complicated.

Hope this helps. Jim

I learned how to speed set dipsies from Jim on the internet, but just want to add: Often times, if you are crabbing with the wind (or into the wind) and the lines in the water are displaced off to one side of the boat, you can still speed set, as long as you maintain a constant boat heading. You would just correct the point where you drop the dipsy into the water further towards the lines that are further away from the boat. For example, if the wind is coming from the Port rear quarter, and the Port side dipsies are further out to the Port side than if trolling straight downwind, you would speed-set a dipsy more towards straight out the back (or even towards the Port side in extreme cases) than from the normal Starboard side of the boat. Another thing, speed setting dipsies works better the faster the boat is travelling. If your boat speed is under 2.0 mph, the speed-set dipsy will sink faster and be more likely to tangle with inside dipsies on that side. This is because the speed-set dipsy is not being pulled off the rod much quicker than it can sink. For someone new to speed setting, 2.5 to 2.8 mph boat speed is a good speed to learn at. One last thing; don't put your dipsy into the water directly behind the motor in the propwash. It has a tendency to disturb the dipsy and leader, sometimes causing the leader to wrap around the front of the dipsy.

[Jim Stedke]

All good points, ....goes to show ....2 heads are better than 1. Thanks Workdog.

[Jim Stedke]

Your post on creel check at Fenwick was very interesting concerning percentage of males. My question to you is the "hogs" you catch trolling in spring are mainly all female so have they already spawned or are they heading to reefs to spawn? I assume they have spawned and back on a "feeding" binge in the deeper water.

I'm not asking to create negative posts on releasing females that have not spawned - just curious.

Thanks!

Mid March & Early April most still have their eggs, about 50/50 until mid April, then all but a few are spawned out.

That's been my experience.

[jimbobber]

JIM ? do you ever troll the reefs , or do you just troll the deeper waters like east of the east can line . say C,D,E, cans . i have never trooled the reef complex do ypu have any stradagies or presantations on the matter

thanx jim:F

[Jim Stedke]

Hey Jim what are some or your favorite size and colors of deep and shallow rouges and huskys?? We ask and talk alot about Reef Runners but not much love for the others!

The gold rouge (that looks more bronze) has done well for me. I call it old blue eyes, and run the deep on more than the shallow. Chrome blue back white belly, and the orange belly have been good, Gold Clown, white w/ a blck back and the the brown one with a white belly that kinda looks like a walleye, are all good colors. I run the ones that about 1/2" shorter,most of the time, but the larger ones will work as well.

Huskys: the glass colors w/ pink, purple, white, blue & green have all worked as have those simulat to the rouge colors. Size 12 mostly ... some 10s. Again more deeps than shallows.

I pay more attention to belly color in the Spring.

I believe Huskys and Rouges are both more bouyant than Reef Runners and the lures are running significantly higher than the book says.

Hope this helps, MORE SUN !!!!

[Jim Stedke]

JIM ? do you ever troll the reefs , or do you just troll the deeper waters like east of the east can line . say C,D,E, cans . i have never trooled the reef complex do ypu have any stradagies or presantations on the matter

thanx jim:F

The reefs are where the males are and all the jiggers after them. I'm sure you could get fish there but I always fish around the N & E cans. Less hastle fewer boats & bigger fish. Sounds like a good combination to me.

[jimbobber]

thanx jim , i think iam going to try that combo

[juicebox]

Jim, lets say that you don't have any numbers to go off of, and you need to locate your own fish. could you run down the process that you would go through, including how long you would work an area before moving on, spreads to start, leads, color variations. what is it about a particular piece of water that you look for when locating a good bite? thanks, Dax

[BOILERWOLF]

Your post on creel check at Fenwick was very interesting concerning percentage of males. My question to you is the "hogs" you catch trolling in spring are mainly all female so have they already spawned or are they heading to reefs to spawn? I assume they have spawned and back on a "feeding" binge in the deeper water.

I'm not asking to create negative posts on releasing females that have not spawned - just curious.

Thanks!

[Jim Stedke]

Dax, I often don't have numbers, but I do have a general idea of what's been happening and general idea of either the water depth the active fish have been in or the general area. Or maybe in don't even have that and have to just go on what should be happening right now.

I spent some time just checking things out. That means keeping an eye on the fish finder from the time we get into fishable water until we get to where we going. The boats we run have units that show fish at speed, and that's huge. If you can't do that, you're at a big disadvantage, and I'd work on trying to gain that edge.

Assuming you can tell somewhat what's a bunch of white bass and what are walleye marks, do some driving around with the plott trail on (so you know where yoou've been), and when you see walleye marks, slow down and set up. If you like to fish down wind, go far enough upwind to get everything out before you get back to this spot. If you can fish upwind, just pick a direction and go. When you get all the lines in if your out of the fish loop back to them. Do some exploratory passes getting some distance away from the starting point looking for heavier concentration of fish and/or bait.

Start with lures from the depth of the most fish up to 10' above the highest marks. Colors are dependant on time of year, part of the lake and water clearity.

If I'm marking fish and can't get bit in 45 minutes, I'll likely move on unless I feel I'm on the best marks around, and then I may change things up and hang in there.

Sorry to be so generalized but it is a generalized question, and I answer like it's May between Kelley's & S Bass and you want info for Aug off Geneva,... you see what I mean.

Good luck, Jim

[Jim Stedke]

Your post on creel check at Fenwick was very interesting concerning percentage of males. My question to you is the "hogs" you catch trolling in spring are mainly all female so have they already spawned or are they heading to reefs to spawn? I assume they have spawned and back on a "feeding" binge in the deeper water.

I'm not asking to create negative posts on releasing females that have not spawned - just curious.

Thanks!

You missed it above... kinda out of order.My bad, here it is again

Mid March & Early April most still have their eggs, about 50/50 until mid April, then all but a few are spawned out.

That's been my experience.

Read more: http://www.ohiogamefishing.com/community/showthread.php?p=1172334#post1172334#ixzz1G9ls9l44

[eye-man]

The boats we run have units that show fish at speed, and that's huge. If you can't do that, you're at a big disadvantage, and I'd work on trying to gain that edge.


Jim,
We have a Lowrance HDS-8 w/ Airmar 50/200 htz transducer. I'm pretty sure it is capable of marking fish at speed but have not figured out how to configure the setting to a) keep bottom lock b) avoid clutter or c)mark fish.
Could you give me any pointers to maybe give me a staring point that I could work with to get us on the right track?

Thanks,
Greg

[Jim Stedke]

Greg, Optimum fish finder performance usually has more to do with transducer location and positioning, then it does with the settings. I'm not familiar enough with that unit to give specifics, but crank up the power, ping speed and screen speed, turn off the fish ID and do not run too much noise reduction. Run the unit on 200 when traveling and on 50 when fishing. If you have the option of spliting the screen and running both at once , that would help you realize the differences, which are substantial.

I'd add that if your transducer was installed level with the lake bottom, try pushing down the back edge of the transducer about 1/8th" to in effect make it shot forward just slightly. This little trick can help clear turbulance and improve performance.

It takes me a couple months to get onto a new fish finder, being on the dark side of 60 technology and I are not as close as we used to be.

I think Lowrance has tutorials that should be beneficial.

Good luck, Jim

[BlueMax]

hey Jim,
Have you ever followed the phases of the moon and the spring walleye spawn and jig bite and early season trolling? What I am getting at is this year we have a full moon very late in March and April. Wondering if you have any information/ experience with the timing of the majority of the spawn and the moon phase. Not being a scientist my mind says that the amount of sunlight, water temp, etc trigger the fish to spawn. Have you ever considered the full moon or new moon in the equation?
I know...come on spring.

[Jim Stedke]

Gene, Bout all things in nature are sensative to moon phases. And tha walleye spawn is as well. Not that all the fish will spawn on or near the full or new moon, but these times will be the peck activity times (if all other conditions are the same).

I've known this for years, but the weather is so marginal this early that I've always simply gone, when I could get away and when it was fit to go. I can honestly say I've never timed a trip around the moon phases. The fishing is good enough that you just don't need to.

[Ogre]

Jim this question is in regards to inline boards and how to reduce board surge. At the boat show seminar you handed out a pamplet that listed the pros and cons between big boards and inlines. I was just reading through it the other day and it got me to thinking. You had on there that one of the cons for small boards was board surge in rougher water and you mentioned that this was a cold water no no. Then I remembered back to a post from last fall when you said that you were out fishing amongst a group of boats and you guys were all using the same lures and settings but they were catching fish and you were not. I think that you attributed it to them using big boards and therefore not having the board surge that you did with your inlines. Some one mentioned in that post that you could use small slide divers to reduce the surge from inline boards in rougher water. Do you think that this is practical and if not can you think of anything that would help. I don't have the ability to run big boards and was just wondering if there was something that I could do to change the lure presentation on those kind of days. Thanks, Andy

[Jim Stedke]

Small slide divers wouldn't work w/ the deep diving lures that we use but they would work w/ stick baits, and that may very well be a good solution to the problem. The fish are high most of the time in these situations so you'd want the diver 50' ahead of the leader but not very far out (like 20 - 30') .

An interesting concept, and one I have not tried, but believe me... I will.

MORE SUN

[rockytop]

snap weights 50 feet infront of spinners and 700 rr will also help. the weight will act like a leever. the weights will surge and come up and down, while the spinner stays at depth.

[Jim Stedke]

That's a good thought as well. Thanks and good fishing.